Day: December 19, 2019

“The Five Things We Need to do to Close the Gender Wage Gap”, with Christie Summervill and Candice…

“The Five Things We Need to do to Close the Gender Wage Gap”, with Christie Summervill and Candice Georgiadis

Make the case for profitability. I think a lot of times people think that doing something positive about wage inequality is going to mean negative consequences for business, but we’ve found that the opposite is actually true. It’s fairly simple: if you’re a company that has a reputation for equitable compensation, you have an easier time recruiting and retaining top talent. That reputation creates a positive feedback loop where you get the best employees who stick around longer and contribute more to your company’s success.

I had the pleasure of interviewing Christie Summervill. When Christie Summervill founded BalancedComp in 2010, her goal was nothing less than to radically reimagine salary administration. With over two decades of leadership in business, Summervill saw that the financial services sector could be getting more out of their compensation strategies, but technology and data quality were holding them back from gaining true insights. What banks and credit unions didn’t need was another complicated spreadsheet, instead, Summervill envisioned a new paradigm for bringing the human back into human resources. The creation of BalancedComp signaled a momentous shift in the landscape of salary administration; a new era where big data started to work for the benefit of people, and financial institutions could begin to benefit from fully integrated compensation design. Summervill envisioned integrated compensation design as a holistic application of data, market analysis and human experience applied to salary and incentive planning in the financial services industry. In the same way that banks and credit unions rationalized lending processes using a variety of tools and inputs, Summervill wanted HR departments to have the structure and information they needed to make confident and knowledgeable decisions about their compensation strategy. Recognizing that compensation design begins with quality data, Summervill builds products for banks and credit unions that apply BalancedComp’s industry-recognized salary survey data to the unique circumstances of each client. The combination of data, technology and customer-focused consulting results in both profitability and equitable salary administration for BalancedComp’s customers. At each stage of innovation, Summervill brings a keen understanding of what matters to the people who use BalancedComp’s products and services. For Summervill, true integrated compensation design means coming alongside her clients in collaboration. Many of the features in BalancedComp’s performance management software are a result of close consultation over years with HR professionals in banking. Her hands-on approach to consulting allows Summervill to see the challenges their clients face first-hand, and her experiences across hundreds of banks and credit unions gives her the expertise to bring novel and effective solutions to the table. In the 10 years since Summervill founded BalancedComp she has grown the company from a regional upstart to a nationally-known and respected compensation design firm, focusing exclusively on financial institutions. BalancedComp advises large and mid-sized banks and credit unions with assets as large as $20B. Summervill’s team of experts in economics, design and data science create and leverage the most comprehensive market reporting available to consistently deliver actionable insights that result in greater equity and profitability for clients undergoing mergers and acquisitions, de novo review and annual compensation alignments.

Thank you so much for joining us! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I’ve loved sales from the time I was a kid selling Girl Scout cookies. Being a salesperson has always been about getting to know other people, listening to their stories and helping them solve problems. When I first started selling in the compensation industry, I worked for a firm where sales weren’t as sophisticated as they could have been. I could still see that there was a lot of potential for positive impact in this field, but in order to achieve that, I needed to strike out on my own.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

One of the most surprising things we run across in compensation design is how commonplace gender discrimination is, even in 2019. I recently encountered an executive who was in charge of certifying appraisers. There were two employees to certify, a man and a woman, and the executive asked the woman to wait on certification, explaining that she could be much more useful to the bank in her current role. She agreed, not knowing that the certification came with a $35,000 pay increase. Why didn’t he ask the man? Why not support both employees in their career advancement? The problem was that this executive was allowed to make decisions based on his intuition and unexamined biases, rather than a rational metric for determining performance.

Can you explain three of the main factors that are causing the wage gap?

Gendered income inequality has been with us for a long time, and there are three broad factors that each play a part in maintaining it: historic, economic and technological. It’s a complicated issue, but in general, women historically have faced discrimination in the workplace, and not only focused on salaries — we’ve all heard of the glass ceiling, for example.

Economically, gendered discrimination is most obvious when comparing paychecks, but this factor also has to do with how women participate in the workforce. For instance, many women leave the workforce shortly after they have children, and there’s not been an agreed upon way to account for this so-called employment gap, yet.

Finally, technology hasn’t been brought to bear on the problem in the ways that it could be, or at least, that’s our proposition at BalancedComp. Given the right tools and high-quality data, we think we can use technology to overcome the challenges presented by the previous two factors and bring actual objectivity to compensation for everyone.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

At BalancedComp, we combine thorough research, data-driven insights, and the latest technology to create intuitive tools for managing compensation and performance reviews in the financial industry. Our platforms help to clarify compensation strategies in order to take a lot of the subjectivity out of the decision-making process. Obviously, there’s always going to be some qualitative component in any human endeavor, but I think we can get a lot closer to knowing what a job should pay based on objective criteria. The end goal is to create actual equity, not just for gender, but for race, age, sexuality — we recently introduced a third gender category in our apps, for example. We hope our work contributes to solving all of these inequalities.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap?

Observe.

First, you have to understand what is really happening in the world. Yes, there is actual gender discrimination and wage disparity, but we need to get better at asking why. The answers are usually more complicated than they first appear.

Rationalize.

Once you see clearly what the problem is, it’s time to figure out what the solution should look like. Do we solve wage gaps by paying everyone the same salary regardless of any other factors, or can we develop equitable solutions that truly account for each individual’s real experiences?

Expand the definition of work.

Part of the wage gap is caused by an inability of the jobs market to account for non-wage work, the majority of which is undertaken by women. This includes stay-at-home moms, but also caregiving for sick or elderly family members and other domestic labor. Having the tools to properly assess someone’s actual experience and skill sets beyond a formal work history can help give a greater clarity to the question of what they should be paid.

Make the case for profitability.

I think a lot of times people think that doing something positive about wage inequality is going to mean negative consequences for business, but we’ve found that the opposite is actually true. It’s fairly simple: if you’re a company that has a reputation for equitable compensation, you have an easier time recruiting and retaining top talent. That reputation creates a positive feedback loop where you get the best employees who stick around longer and contribute more to your company’s success.

Be bold and talk about your successes (and sometimes your struggles).

It’s not easy to lead the way, but those companies that create true innovation and societal advancement are the companies we all remember and look to for inspiration. We want to hear about companies that are succeeding at bringing equity to their compensation strategies — it’s great news and should be celebrated! It’s also important to engage the difficulties in order to find better solutions. At BalancedComp, we are always looking for that next challenge: what did we do right today, and what will be difficult tomorrow?

You are a person of great influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. 🙂

I’d love it if all businesses would begin rationalizing how they pay their employees and develop an understanding that profitability is a goal, not a tactic. The current method for a lot of companies is to treat profitability as opposed to spending money on compensation, but my experience is that it’s almost the opposite case. Companies that understand how to pay their employees appropriately, and not just however little they can get away with, tend to perform much better in the long run. Recruitment, retention and productivity all increase when your people are making enough money to stay focused on their job, and focused on improving at their job. Paying well to begin with and having an objective plan for raises and bonuses can make a huge impact on a company’s bottom line, and not only for the company! The employees benefit, too, by having resources to improve their lives, whether that’s buying a house, saving for a vacation or starting a family.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

“If you want to go fast, go alone, if you want to go far, go together” — author unknown

I’ve always felt that this quote is a perfect way to describe my startup. At the beginning, when I was by myself I could make quick decisions, but it was a lot harder to make strategic decisions. Now that I’ve got a team of brilliant people, we can all take the time to really think about where we want the company to go, sometimes even far out into the future. It isn’t an opposition between fast and far — we can still go plenty fast — but for me the quote is all about understanding how you approach a task or a job has a lot to do with what you’ll eventually get out of it.

We are very blessed that some of the biggest names in Business, VC funding, Sports, and Entertainment read this column. Is there a person in the world, or in the US whom you would love to have a private breakfast or lunch with, and why? He or she might see this, especially if we tag them. 🙂

Mother Teresa, because of the work she did with the poor, she could have used her celebrity in her own self-interest, but she used it to continue to help others. One of our core values is generosity. We don’t want to be merely a successful company, we want to leave the world better than we found it. Everything we’re doing is about doing good: by the businesses, by the employees, by our team at BalancedComp. Solving comp has a real impact on actual lives.

Thank you for all of these great insights!

“The Five Things We Need to do to Close the Gender Wage Gap”, with Christie Summervill and Candice… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Kristin S Kaufman and Candice…

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Kristin S. Kaufman and Candice Georgiadis

Build flexibility into the workplace. With the advent of technology and platforms like Skype, Zoom, Go-To Meeting, etc. there is no reason high-level jobs must require 24/7 travel commitments. We can easily run large global businesses online and these innovative tools help offer flexibility and increased productivity.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing Kristin S. Kaufman. Kristin is the founder of Alignment, Inc. ® a unique consultancy formed in 2007 to help individuals, corporations, board of directors and other similar groups find alignment within themselves and their organizations. She’s brought this expertise to hundreds of people since establishing Alignment, Inc®. Some of her clients include Baylor Healthcare System, Accenture, Hewlett-Packard, Smith & Nephew, Frito-Lay, IDEA Public Schools, Boys and Girls Clubs of America, Mercy Health, and many others. Kristin brings over 25 years of corporate experience to bear, including executive positions at Hewlett-Packard, Vignette Corporation, and United Health Group. At HP, Kristin was the General Manager of the channels and partner program that supported Hewlett-Packard’s largest corporate accounts. This business represented a $3 billion revenue stream for Hewlett-Packard. Serving as Worldwide Channels Vice-President on the Executive Committee of Vignette Corporation, a $250 million publicly traded software company, her team built the global infrastructure for multi-channels of distribution for their software solution. In her first departure from traditional ‘corporate America’, Kristin was asked to join the NYC Leadership Academy effort, which was the centerpiece of the New York City Children First reform agenda. New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg and Chancellor Joel Klein sponsored this agenda, lead by CEO Robert E. Knowling, Jr. The goal of this reform was to create a system of outstanding schools where every child and teacher has access to effective teaching and learning. Kristin was chosen as one of two private sector business executives, to teach, train, and coach the 1,200 principals of the NYC public school system and the top 100 executives on the Chancellor’s staff. This three-year experience was the initial catalyst for Kristin forming Alignment, Inc. ® Her last executive position in corporate America was as Group Vice President of United Health Group. This appointment leveraged her strong knowledge of the technology business and how to leverage multiple channels to market in the increasingly complicated world of healthcare and healthcare insurance. Kristin provided expertise for its go-to-market strategies, defined and created alternative channels to improve organic growth, and implemented sales effectiveness methodologies across all segments within United Health Group. A prolific writer, Kristin’s first book, Is This Seat Taken? Random Encounters That Change Your Life, was released on 11/1/11 to national acclaim, and endorsed by Stephen Covey and John Maxwell, among others. Her second book in the series, entitled Is This Seat Taken? It’s Never Too Late to Find the Right Seat was released in January, 2015. It has been endorsed by notables such as Marshall Goldsmith, Sean Covey, and Doug Parker, CEO of American Airlines. This book shines the light on late in life reinvention and encore ‘second half’s’ of diverse individuals. The individuals are in some cases widely known and others are somewhat anonymous to the mass public. The common thread is their ‘post-50’ resurgence in life and in some cases their ‘fork in the road’ is quite serendipitous. Kristin’s third book, in the ‘Is This Seat Taken?’ trilogy was released October 8, 2019.

Thank you so much for joining us, Kristin! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

My adulthood journey and professional career had been centered primarily in the corporate arena. Until about 15 years ago, my life had been a series of accomplishments, achievements, awards, and rewards. I had experienced success on pretty much every level. Then, I made the choice to ‘jump off the hamster wheel’ and devote my energies to becoming truly integrated and aligned to my purpose. I realized I had ‘lost the plot’ of my then current corporate executive role — and desired to learn, grow, transcend and include all parts of who I am. I sought true alignment — which by my definition is loving what I do, being good at, and most importantly — having it tied to something much greater then myself. Working with global leaders, their teams, and boards of directors is fulfilling, challenging, and rewarding — and without question is my calling toward alignment.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

When we work with corporate leaders, the stories are varied, interesting, and surprising. No one engagement is more interesting than another — as they are all challenging and test one’s intuition, judgment, wisdom, and counsel.

One of the most compelling — and this story has been repeated more than once — is the realization of a senior level executive that the quest for big income packages, large spans of control, and a heady title does NOT equate to fulfillment or ‘success’. Despite the trappings of a huge, powerful position — this executive was miserable.

What has been fascinating to experience is the epiphany an executive has that true success is defined by his/her own parameters….not by society, the ‘powers that be’, conventional rules, or discriminating ‘head hunters’. Success is defined on their terms…and it changes as we mature, evolve, and how we make meaning in our lives.

Ok let’s jump to the main focus of our interview. Even in 2019, women still earn about 80 cents for every dollar a man makes. Can you explain three of the main factors that are causing the wage gap?

The gender wage gap is complex with many interrelated factors coming into play. A few thoughts:

Women’s’ competencies, skills, and contributions have been traditionally under recognized and undervalued. Even when women are in the same position, gender stereotypes tend to categorize women differently — which hinders promo ability, salary ranges, among other factors. Women have been historically inappropriately — and unjustifiably — categorized as not as committed due to their being mothers, or being perceived as less competent — simply due to their being female. In several studies, this has been validated, when mock applications were sent using ‘female-sounding’ names, the ‘male-sounding’ names were viewed more favorably AND offered jobs with higher-paying salaries. And to add to this reality, there are historically –and currently — more men in senior level roles than women — thus, this fact adds credence to men being ‘paid more’ just by the nature of them holding higher level positions. One last piece of this equation is the factor that women historically have chosen lower-paying roles (think women choosing nursing over becoming doctors, or women choosing teaching versus men choosing engineering). This trend is clearly changing; yet the historic figures do not lie. Net: all of these observations are clearly ‘wrong’ and changes are coming, yet very slowly.
Historically, legislation has not supported equal pay or equal opportunity for women. Forty years after the first equal pay legislation was put into effect (the Equal Pay Act of 1970), women can still expect to be paid less. The law has made a big difference, however, often women don’t know they are underpaid. People (men and women) are often secretive about how much they are paid — and if a person wants to bring a case against an employer — that is an expensive proposition. The employer has deeper coffers to defend their actions than the individual employee…..not to mention the potential stain on the employee of filing a suit.
Finally, and this may not be what female reader will want to hear; however, often women lack the confidence to demand equal pay for equal work. Women need to stand tall, know their worth, and demand equal pay. A mentor of mine once told me that the market (internal and external) will assign the value on you which you assign to yourself. This nugget has served me well throughout my career. Coupled with this, women need to help other women. It is appalling for me to still observe high-ranking women NOT reaching down to help other women. This is unacceptable; yet, it still is a reality in corporate America.

Net: I believe in equal opportunity and equal pay for equal work. I am NOT a believer in giving women — or men — unfair advantage based on their gender. That is simply obsolete thinking. Also, we must caution against reverse discrimination; that over-rotation will undermine the pure intention of equal opportunity for all.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

My work focuses on helping individuals reach their potential. With my clients — male and female — I focus on helping them gain confidence, learn strong negotiating skills, how to strategically plot their career, and build plans to optimize their career progression. I also hold the mirror for both genders (male and female) to become aware of discriminating behaviors and help them to grow beyond the learned conventional behaviors which are stagnating their evolution as a leader in the 21st century.

Can you recommend 4 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap.

A few thoughts:

Be transparent about pay. It is appalling to me, from the studies I have read, that the average full-time working woman earns just .75 to .79 cents for every dollar man earns. We need to have transparency about wages AND merit increases. There is nothing to lose and so much to gain to level the playing field and pay based on skill, competency, met deliverables, contribution to the bottom line — and to the over-arching corporate culture — 100% independent of gender.
Invest in men and women equally. Ongoing investments in the high-potential employees helps the person and the organization for which they work. These individuals will become the leaders of the organization going forward. These investments can take the form of ongoing education, mentoring and networking programs (internally and externally), and training about the ‘elephant in the room’ aka: unconscious bias training, etc.
Build diversity and inclusion into the organizational values — and this is not the ‘old fashioned playbook’ of how to do this. This means treating diversity as an asset which needs to be built, honed, and enhanced over time. This creates a culture that accepts and rewards all employees — regardless of race, gender, or background. This is our sacred responsibility in our professional lives.
Build flexibility into the workplace. With the advent of technology and platforms like Skype, Zoom, Go-To Meeting, etc. there is no reason high-level jobs must require 24/7 travel commitments. We can easily run large global businesses online and these innovative tools help offer flexibility and increased productivity.

My work focuses on three main points:

First, we live in the present moment — that is really all we have. We have to pay attention — to the spoken and the unspoken — to learn, teach, and serve at our highest capacity. Secondly, we are all part of an integral and collective experience. Thousands of individuals unknowingly help to create our life’s journey — personally and professionally. Thus, we are not in competition with one another — we are here to collaborate, teach, learn, serve, and love through our actions, behaviors, contributions, and authentic presence.

Finally, we create the lives we desire to live. We define success on our terms. It is simply never too late — net: we own it.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

There are many quotes which have steered my choices — and my favorite quote changes as I change.

The one which resonates with me now is from James Hollis,

“Our lives find our purpose — not in answers but in living large questions that are worthy of the soul’s magnitude”.

Thus, I encourage individuals which whom I work (as well as myself) to live in question. Nestle into ambiguity. We own the quest for the answers, if we have the courage to dig deep and face the paradoxes of life.

I have watched Brene Brown’s contributions over the past number of years with admiration and gratitude. She has de-stigmatized shame and done so with humor. She has anchored her perspectives with research and data, which is a powerful grounding. Her work is seminal and is changing lives.

This was really meaningful! Thank you so much for your time.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Kristin S Kaufman and Candice… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Anne Shoemaker and Candice Georgiadis

I advise the women I work with to ask for a big raise for a few reasons: a) I hope they get it, and b) if they don’t get it, I want them to get as much information about how their compensation is determined as possible. If the company is unwilling to share a salary band for their position, I encourage an open dialogue about advancement opportunities. If a woman learns that she is already tapped out at her current employer, that is good information to have- it might be time to polish up the resume.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing Anne Shoemaker. Anne is an executive in the commercial real estate development industry and a wife and mom to two children. In an effort to support and elevate women as they progress in their career, Anne launched a coaching and consulting business that is focused on helping career women overcome limiting beliefs, develop courage and confidence, and succeed in compensation conversations in the workplace. AnneShoemaker.com

Thank you so much for joining us, Anne! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I launched my small business based on a pattern of questions that I was fielding from female colleagues and junior associates. It went like this: “I just got a promotion that I’m excited about, but it didn’t come with an increase in pay … Can you help me make my case?” Or, “I’m going on maternity leave soon and want to propose a short-term, part-time schedule to ease the transition back to work. However, I don’t want this to have long-term (negative) consequences. How can I make a successful pitch to my employer?” And more. I am finding that many women need both an ally and some practical help when it comes to advocating for what they want, need, and deserve in the workplace. Having served as a hiring manager in the past, I help women make a compelling case that meets both their needs and their employer’s expectations.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

I started my coaching and consulting business as an outcome of women seeking validation and encouragement to ask for what they believe they deserve in the workplace. Oftentimes, what they are really looking for is courage and confidence. I have learned, repeatedly, that we all need encouragement. The advice I give women may be advice they are already considering- they just need someone to talk it through with and some strategies for execution. I am pleased and honored to offer them both.

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

I launched my business via an email campaign to several hundred people, certain that I would get some “congrats!” and “way to go!” responses, but not expecting any real clients (at first). Wrong! I was shocked when I had a short client list right away. My first thought was, “I can’t do this! I’m not qualified!” The very medicine that my business promised to administer (courage and confidence in the face of uncertainty) was the same that I was now desperate for. But, like jumping into a pool of cool water on the first not-so-hot day of summer, I went for it. The exercise proved to be a good reminder of just how scary pushing past our limiting beliefs can be, and that no one — coach or client alike — is immune to feeling like a fraud when they’re plowing new ground. I needed the advice I have now given so often: in order to grow, you must get comfortable being uncomfortable.

One factor that leads to pay disparity is societal conditioning of boys and girls. In Brave, Not Perfect, Reshma Saujani states, “In girls, the drive to be perfect shows up, and bravery shuts down, around age 8, right around the time our inner critic shows up.” She goes on to say, “Unlike girls, boys are rewarded with approval and praise for taking chances, even if things don’t work out. In other words: boys are taught to be brave while girls are taught to be perfect.” Taking risks and failing are critical components the produce learning and growth, first in school and later, in the workplace; we need to praise girls for risk-taking as a critical component to their learning and advancement.

When girls and women hold themselves back for fear of imperfection, they open the floor for men (who have become accustomed to, and comfortable with, failure) to advance. Before you know it, another class of men reaches the C-suite and the cycle repeats itself.

So, we need to normalize risk-taking for girls so they can develop the resilience necessary to climb the corporate ladder and earn the bigger paycheck.

Meanwhile, there are women who have broken through these societal expectations and blazed a new trail, only to find that wage secrecy is working against them. They land an esteemed position only to later learn that their male peer out-earns them. Had there been salary transparency from the outset, all candidates could negotiate from a position of strength with the most qualified and valuable candidate earning the biggest paycheck.

Finally, insufficient home/work support structures (e.g., flex-work options such as remote work or flexible scheduling) work against women’s ability to advance to higher-salaried positions. Consider a scenario whereby commitment to a company and the related gateway to advancement is based on facetime in the office. If the C-suite is dominated by men whose spouses are not in the workforce, there is little need for flexible scheduling or advance notice about late afternoon meetings. However, if a woman is trying to break into this level and comes from a dual-career household, she may need flexibility or a bigger paycheck (or both) in order to manage both home and work, or to hire out help at home. If the company perceives her request for a flexible working arrangement as a) a distraction or inconvenience they would rather not work around, b) a deterrent from the company’s objectives, c) offering her something that they don’t want to offer to others, or d) “playing favorites” by making an exception for her, then she will not receive the support she needs to compete and excel at the next level of career growth. Werk.co put together an excellent report on the topic of the importance of flexibility in the modern workplace; this report is required reading for senior level staff.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

Every day, in every client meeting, I show up with and for women, eager to hear what their internal dialogue is as it pertains to their self-worth and the value they bring to the workplace. I have coached some very bright, accomplished executive women who know that they are bringing unique skills and insights to bear, and yet when it comes time to enter the lion’s den (so to speak) to advocate for equal pay, they start to doubt themselves. My goal is to help them get a view of the facts from a third-party, objective viewpoint. I find the logic in their argument, then help them package it and leverage it in conversation. Ultimately, my goal is for my clients to believe in their worth beyond the shadow of a doubt, then bring facts and logic to the negotiation table. There is no reason, no excuse, and no room for them to be paid a dime less than any peer, male or female, with the same skill set. But, the first person they have to convince of this fact is themselves.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

Attention & investment from high-profile influencers in the private sector such as Melinda Gates and Sallie Krawcheck. (top-down approach). When Melinda Gates committed $1 billion to promote gender equality in Oct. 2019, people took notice. She founded Pivotal Ventures and launched a media campaign (#EqualityCantWait) to draw attention to the issue. Gates has tremendous influence with people in positions of power worldwide and has now committed resources to make an impact. Announcing this initiative was just the beginning; her legacy in this space will be astounding.
Attention from pop culture icons (bottom-up approach), such as Michelle Williams’ 2019 Emmy speech and Megan Rapinoe of the U.S. Women’s National Soccer Team, Sports Illustrated’s 2019 Sportsperson of the Year (only the 4th female ever to win the honor in 66 years). Speaking of a worldwide stage, it would be hard to find an American or international soccer fan (the world’s #1 sport) who did not witness Megan Rapinoe & the U.S. Women’s National Soccer Team win a record-setting fourth World Cup in 2019. Her decision to snub the White House in favor of advocating for women’s equity garnered plenty of attention. Rapinoe is boldly trying to start a movement by inviting influential males into the process as well (see: Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo)
Committee chairpersons/sponsors (preferably male) at the state and federal regulatory levels and/or ongoing sponsorship on this issue by an influential male business leader. The week of Dec. 16th, 2019, former President Barack Obama made remarks about the benefits that women in leadership positions bring to the world stage. While his remarks were not about pay equity, they do cast a light on the benefits that women bring to decision making and seats of power. To close the gender wage gap, we need influential men to advocate for women’s pay equity.
Coaching of women and girls of all ages to become more skilled in self-advocacy. In hiring babysitters, I am struck every time a young woman (typically high school age) responds to my compensation question, “What’s your rate?”, with “Whatever you want to pay me is fine! ?” No, no, no! We need to counsel young women to start their rate with confidence: “I charge $12/hour for two kids”. Bam- done. When we start our careers off with a flippant “Whatever”, we start the habit of discounting our skills and our worth. This cannot continue.
Pay transparency to eliminate asymmetrical information. In my coaching practice, I advise the women I work with to ask for a big raise for a few reasons: a) I hope they get it, and b) if they don’t get it, I want them to get as much information about how their compensation is determined as possible. If the company is unwilling to share a salary band for their position, I encourage an open dialogue about advancement opportunities. If a woman learns that she is already tapped out at her current employer, that is good information to have- it might be time to polish up the resume.

I am passionate about women’s pay equity worldwide. In the U.S., women are fighting to equal pay for equal work. In other parts of the world, women are simply fighting for the right to work. Just think about how much further along we could be as a human race if we were to leverage the insights and talents of ALL the population. The seats of power have historically been held by men, representing and fully leveraging only half of the human experience to date, which means we are only halfway to our potential! Women have tremendous insight to offer corporations and the public sector; there are bodies of research that demonstrate the gains in performance that a company experiences after diversifying the boardroom. It is time that we intentionally clear a pathway of opportunity for women to be seated at tables of influence whereby they are paid equally to their male counterparts.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

“I refuse to live as half of myself just because others cannot handle all of me.” Rachel Hollis

I came upon this quote while reading Hollis’s 2018 NYT bestseller, “Girl, Wash Your Face”. It was a call to arms. I had been living a life that put others’ comfort before my own, and it was making me sick. I have always had a big engine- tons of energy, tons of enthusiasm, and more ambition than even I knew what to do with. However, I had been conditioned to tamp down these qualities because they intimidate and overwhelm other people. When I read this sentence, it hit me straight in the gut: I did not have to make myself small any longer. It was an empowering moment- I won’t forget it.

I would love to meet Sara Blakely. Her entrepreneurial journey is so inspiring to me, as is the way she shows up online via social media and what we see of how she engages with her family. The mission at Spanx of supporting and elevating women is near and dear to my heart. I love what Sara Blakely is all about.

This was really meaningful! Thank you so much for your time.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Anne Shoemaker and Candice Georgiadis was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“5 things that need to be done to close the gender wage gap”, with Bridget Deiters and Candice…

“5 things that need to be done to close the gender wage gap”, with Bridget Deiters and Candice Georgiadis

…Disproportionate focus on recruitment rather than retention. In law, admirable efforts have been made to recruit more women into the profession, but we are learning that retention may be even more important than recruitment for narrowing the gender pay gap. April 2018 numbers showed that 54% of legal professionals in the U.K. were women, but despite this proportion in favour of female lawyers, there is a gender pay gap of over 16 percent. This indicates that there are plenty of women recruited into the legal profession, but that few of them are retained to reach the highest pay levels.

I had the pleasure of interviewing Bridget Deiters. Bridget is a London-based managing director at InCloudCounsel, a legal technology company that frees large companies from high-volume legal work. Prior to InCloudCounsel, Deiters practiced corporate and capital markets law at the law firms Kirkland & Ellis in London and Chicago and Cravath, Swaine & Moore in London and New York.

Thank you so much for joining us Bridget! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I started my career as a corporate attorney at large international law firms, working for them in both the United States and London. While I planned for my career to take me away from private practice eventually, working at those firms provided access to the legal training and professional network that constitute the foundation of my career.

Technology always fascinated me, and in fact I worked on firmwide projects while I was in private practice to create databases and online resources for lawyers at the firm to increase efficiency. Toward the end of my years as a law firm associate, I worked with career coaches to build a plan for my future focused on leveraging my strengths and interests and moving toward my personal definition of success. I am grateful I had the opportunity to set aside that time and energy for that self-reflection, as it was invaluable as I assessed my options before leaving the firm, as it wasn’t long after that exercise when I received the opportunity to join InCloudCounsel, a legal technology company focused on driving efficiency for routine legal work, where I am able to leverage my law firm experience while embracing my interest in technology.

My work with respect to the gender pay gap in law arose as a result of the enactment of laws in the U.K. (where I was practicing at the time) mandating the disclosure of the gender pay gap at companies with over 250 employees from 2018. It was shocking to see in black and white what had always been a hunch: men were making far more than women at most law firms, despite earnest gender diversity programming. As I considered my next role, eager to be part of the solution for this inequality, I made it a priority to join a company that was taking a different approach to the legal profession, and InCloudCounsel is doing just that.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

Since moving from a law firm to a legal tech company, I’ve been fascinated by how our software engineers can convert nuanced legal concepts into software systems. I recently worked with them to create a piece of software that helps with legal compliance. While doing so, I realized that engineers and lawyers have more in common than you might think. Just like engineers coding a new piece of software, corporate lawyers drafting a contract parse through all the scenarios that could arise from each decision that is made, then they proactively incorporate the necessary workarounds to achieve the desired result. Both disciplines require extreme attention to detail and strategic planning. It was interesting (and humbling) to see firsthand how the legal profession can benefit from non-lawyers!

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

As a junior attorney at large law firms, I thought it was inappropriate to ask clients and others in the working group outside the firm to connect with me on LinkedIn or AngelList. I feared doing so would come across as too self-promotional, overly familiar or “salesy,” and I was conscious that there were delicate client relationships involved at the partner level. I was careful to save contact details, but I never connected with them outside of whatever project we were working on.

I realized later as I became more senior what a mistake this had been for many reasons. First of all, no matter how diligent I was about saving contact details, they were useless once the person changed jobs, which happens quite regularly. Secondly, I shouldn’t have been afraid of coming across as self-promotional, overly familiar or transactional. If someone makes themselves available on a professional networking site, they are actively building a network, and you may be able to contribute just as much to their network as they can to yours. Third, I was foolish to think a LinkedIn invitation would incite backlash at the partner level — in the event the contact didn’t want to connect with me, they could simply reject my invitation or ignore me. Finally, rather than merely saving contact details, I should have been actively nurturing connections even as a junior lawyer. Making contact with someone outside the normal work context is the first step in that kind of relationship building, even if it just starts with an invitation to your online network.

Ok let’s jump to the main focus of our interview. Even in 2019, women still earn about 80 cents for every dollar a man makes. Can you explain three of the main factors that are causing the wage gap?

Disproportionate focus on recruitment rather than retention. In law, admirable efforts have been made to recruit more women into the profession, but we are learning that retention may be even more important than recruitment for narrowing the gender pay gap. April 2018 numbers showed that 54% of legal professionals in the U.K. were women, but despite this proportion in favour of female lawyers, there is a gender pay gap of over 16 percent. This indicates that there are plenty of women recruited into the legal profession, but that few of them are retained to reach the highest pay levels. On average, women outnumber men in all four pay quartiles of U.K. law firms. For U.S. and international firms reporting in the U.K., women outnumber men in all but the top pay quartile of those firms on average. Gender pay gap reporting for U.K. law firms indicates that on average the lowest quartile of employees was comprised of 26.5 percent men and 73.5 percent women. The highest quartile was comprised of 47.8 percent men and 52.2 percent women. It should be mentioned that the U.K. reporting requirements do not allow for a distinction between legal professionals and non-professionals employed at law firms. That being said, assuming fee-generating legal professionals comprise the highest quartile of law firm employees, in U.K. firms, there are actually more women in that echelon than men, but the women in that quartile are being compensated less than their male counterparts.
Traditional gender roles with respect to dependent care. Despite an increase in parental leave regardless of gender, and despite the frequency with which families have two working parents, traditional gender roles with respect to dependent care persist. For example, according to the American Bar Association, almost half of women identified caretaking commitments as important or very important factors in why they left their law firm jobs, whereas only 20 percent of men cited caretaking as a reason for departure. In that statistic, traditional gender norms are probably at work in ways: women may do more caretaking than men as a result of those norms, but also as a result of those gender norms women probably feel more comfortable than their male counterparts when it comes to reporting dependent care as a reason for leaving a job.
Inflexible partner tracks and corporate ladders that ignore social trends. Studies show that women with college degrees tend to start having children an average of 7 years later than women who do not have a college degree. The reason for this is thought to be the time it takes to establish a career and generate income following college or university. Following that logic, it can be assumed that women with professional degrees probably start having children even later. The average age of women in New York City with college degrees to have their first child is 32.9; in San Francisco, it’s 33.4. With partner tracks generally ranging from 7 to 10 years, the time most female lawyers are having children coincides with the time when they are under consideration for partnership in law or when many people are tapped for leadership positions in corporate roles. The timing of these decisions being when someone is getting close to mid-career (often in their 30s) can leave some women feeling that they have to choose between having a family and reaching the highest rung on the ladder, and many women leave high-paying professional roles as they choose the former.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

InCloudCounsel offers lawyers an entirely new way to work that takes into consideration many of the challenges faced in the gender pay gap battle. As a result, InCloudCounsel has outstanding retention rates for men and women alike, and female solo practitioners on our platform actually earn more than their male counterparts on average. There are several aspects of our legal process outsourcing model that allow us to maintain this balance. For one, attorneys who work on our platform work entirely remotely, which means there is no “face-time” expectation. This flexibility with respect to location allows men and women alike to meet obligations outside of work without negatively impacting their career trajectories, an important option when so many attorneys who leave law firms cite dependent care as a reason for their departure.

As discussed above, rigid career tracks can leave some women feeling that they have to choose between having a family and professional success. At InCloudCounsel, there is no looming deadline for career development, as our lawyers are allowed to moderate their capacity as needed to balance competing priorities. This allows men and women alike to plan their career trajectory around their personal lives.

InCloudCounsel also has a fixed compensation model that gives lawyers total transparency with respect to their income. Law firm compensation can be affected by market conditions, deal flow and case flow, performance relative to peers, and team size, but it often isn’t until an annual review or a year-end bonus that lawyers know whether those factors had an impact on their earnings. Even then, it isn’t entirely clear whether earnings are performance-based, hours-based, or some combination. This lack of transparency combined with reported statistics showing that men are paid more than women in law firms often leaves female lawyers feeling disenchanted and unmotivated. With the fixed InCloudCounsel compensation model, the only variable with respect to compensation is how many documents the lawyer has worked on, which is a function of that lawyer’s self-reported availability and desire to take on work.

Finally, InCloudCounsel allows its lawyers to moderate their capacity to work on our platform in a way that traditional law firms have not. Many women indicate that the challenges to ramping off and ramping back on for parental leave in the law firm setting affect their decision to stay at the firm. At InCloudCounsel, our teams are easily scalable to accommodate instances of parental leave, health issues, and other personal time. Our lawyers can increase or decrease their capacity as needed during hectic or quiet times in their lives.

This should come as no surprise, but it would be closing the gender pay gap. This is a worldwide issue, and while it may seem like a gender-specific issue, the economic discrepancy between men and women has macro-effects on everything from human rights to big business.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

As I thought about where my career would take me after I left the well-beaten path of the law firm, I came across the English saying “Different horses for different courses,” which they often shorten to “horses for courses.” It’s a reference to horse racing, where it isn’t always the horse that can run the fastest who wins the race, but rather the horse that can run the course the best. Some horses excel on dry courses, others do best in the mud; some are sprinters, others are distance runners. At work, in school, and in life generally, I was prone, as many are, to spending more time focused on improving my weaknesses than on wielding my strengths. Thus, the phrase “horses for courses” inspired me to focus on finding a course that lets me leverage my strengths rather than spending my energy on a course defined by my weaknesses.

Thank you for all of these great insights!

“5 things that need to be done to close the gender wage gap”, with Bridget Deiters and Candice… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.