Day: January 13, 2020

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Lyn Johnson of West Tenth

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

While the wage gap is certainly something we need to be concerned about, the larger issue we need to address is the wealth gap. Women are accumulating financial resources at 1/3rd the rate that men are. Which means women are more likely to find themselves in positions of economic vulnerability and are more likely to be impoverished after retiring. The wealth gap is the end result of a lifetime of wage disparity and women’s lack of access to capital. Wealth is the number to watch.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing Lyn johnson. Lyn began her career at PwC in New York in their banking and capital markets division and later became the CFO of Locus Financial, a financial advisory firm located in Santa Monica. She started West Tenth during her MBA year at the University of Oxford Saïd Business School. She is the mother of three boys and an unapologetic spreadsheet geek.

Thank you so much for joining us Lyn! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I was a CFO at a private financial advisory firm and had just had my third child when I began to feel restless — as though graduate school was calling me. So I applied to the University of Oxford and moved my family to the UK to pursue an MBA full-time there.

During my graduate studies I had the opportunity to research an issue that had been bothering me for years: the economic disadvantages that women face as they juggle sometimes impossible choices between work and caring for family. The more I researched, the more I realized that the talents women develop outside the workforce are under-utilized by our current economy. I also knew that families like mine could benefit hugely from their talents if there was an easier way to access them.

This realization planted the seeds that led to starting West Tenth instead of returning to my finance career.

I pitched the West Tenth concept — a marketplace that encourages women to market their unique, everyday talents to their local communities — in several university competitions. I was either a finalist or winner in those competitions and that gave me the confidence to bring West Tenth to life. I also met my co-founder, Andi Garavaglia, during my time at school. She joined me last year after we graduated and we’ve been building West Tenth together since then.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

The most interesting part of this startup life can be summed up in one word for me: discovery. I’ve discovered my own ability to navigate the unknown, I’ve discovered places in Los Angeles and abroad I never would have visited otherwise, and best of all I’ve discovered the talented women running home-based businesses in my own community that I didn’t know about until now. Who knew that there were women who could print edible photos on cookies literally down the street from me? Or women who could make eco-friendly travel plans for your next family vacation? The variety and vibrancy of women’s talents is surprising even me.

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

When we first started West Tenth, I was looking for ways to recruit women with home-based businesses onto our platform. I randomly met a woman who told me she was part of a large women’s networking group and invited me to come to their next meeting, which sounded like just what I was looking for.

When it came time for the meeting, I pulled up to the address listed on the invite, looked around and began to get a little wary. I arrived at the check-in desk and realized that this was a women’s charity club made up primarily of retirees and other ‘ladies who lunch’. I was the youngest person there by about 20 years and the ladies at the desk let me know that business networking or promoting of any sort was not allowed. I started to gently excuse myself — clearly this was a rabbit hole that I didn’t mean to go down — but the lovely woman who invited me spotted me from across the room and ushered me into my seat before I knew what was happening.

The meeting lasted four hours, included a luncheon and a lesson on monarch butterflies. I was tapping my feet impatiently and responding to work messages on my phone the entire time. At the end of the meeting, my hostess turned to me with eager eyes and, as everyone at my table listened in expectantly, said, “Well, what do you think? Would you like to join our club? All you have to do is write a check.”

I thought to myself, “How did I even end up here?? I will never get these four hours of my life back.”

So I looked her straight in the eyes, smiled kindly, and without hesitation said “Sign me up!” I just could not bring myself to tell this group of sweet women ‘no’. I ended up paying an annual fee to join, donating an additional amount for their charity fund, and somehow volunteered myself to put together a tea basket for their annual auction. What a sucker.

Needless to say, I didn’t attend regularly. But a few of the women I met there ended up being some of my fiercest community advocates. The lesson to me was to embrace community — no matter where you find it — and that generosity is never wasted. I also happened to learn a great deal about monarch butterflies. 😉

Ok let’s jump to the main focus of our interview. Even in 2019, women still earn about 80 cents for every dollar a man makes. Can you explain three of the main factors that are causing the wage gap?

There are so many institutional forces at play that encourage everyone (including women themselves) to undervalue women’s skills. We hold collective beliefs about women that include an expectation that they will place the interests of their communities above their own interests. To that end, we expect women to dispense of their time and talents for free or at a discount — a factor that contributes immensely to the wage gap. (Note: A community mindset can be an incredibly positive force, but when juxtaposed with the expectations we have for men, which permit and encourage them to act in their own interests, we place women at a comparative disadvantage.) Couple those gendered expectations with the fact that the unpaid work of women who care for families has been assigned literally zero economic value in terms of dollars (their work is not even counted in national GDP numbers) and you have a recipe for the societal undervaluing of their skills and an undermining of their earning capabilities.
Our government and societal institutions have created a ‘choice funnel’ that skew women’s decisions towards leaving the workforce after children. Without paid parental leaves or affordable childcare options, and with tax & school systems that favor one-earner married households, women’s ability to remain in the workforce and achieve a balanced family life is very constrained.
A huge imbalance still exists between women and men in the allocation of domestic and caregiving work, which subverts women’s earning potential. Married women with children spend less time earning in the marketplace, less time in leisure activities, and more time in unpaid work in comparison to their male counterparts.

While the wage gap is certainly something we need to be concerned about, the larger issue we need to address is the wealth gap. Women are accumulating financial resources at 1/3rd the rate that men are. Which means women are more likely to find themselves in positions of economic vulnerability and are more likely to be impoverished after retiring. The wealth gap is the end result of a lifetime of wage disparity and women’s lack of access to capital. Wealth is the number to watch.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

Our startup, West Tenth, is a digital marketplace that encourages women to market their talents to their neighbors, friends, and community. We believe that women develop incredible talents in their time away from the traditional workforce and that these talents hold monetary value for their communities. We are helping unlock access to women’s skills.

Where some may see a woman with a cute hobby or a knack for a particular task, West Tenth sees a potential entrepreneur. On the West Tenth marketplace, families & individuals can find and utilize the expertise of local women to help enhance their home and personal lives.

West Tenth is also creating a low-risk, low-capital avenue for women to create businesses from their homes based on their existing skill sets. We are encouraging society to take a second look at the economic value women bring to the table and we are helping women capture more of their own import.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

1.Men need to take a more active role in the home and need to advocate for parent-friendly work policies: As a society, we need to ensure that fatherhood is regarded as highly as motherhood and that men have the opportunity to create deep and nurturing relationships with their children. When men are given the chance to fully participate in family life and women are given the chance to thrive at work with the expectation of full partnership from their partners at home, we will make big strides in reducing the wage gap.

2.Paid parental leave for mothers and fathers:

Paid maternity leave allows mothers to physically recover from childbirth and give their newborns the very intense care they need without risking financial insolvency. Paid leaves of adequate duration increase the likelihood that women will return to work, which helps reduce the wage gap in the long term. When fathers are extended paid paternity leave, not only do they get the chance to bond with their babies and care for their recovering partners, they are also more likely to take on an equal share of domestic and childcare work. Paternity leaves allow men to also become experts in family life and share in the work from day one.

3. Greater allocation of capital to women: Business ownership, although difficult, is one of the most effective ways to build wealth. Women face an extra layer of difficulty when starting businesses because they lack adequate access to capital. Only 2% of equity financing was directed towards female-founded companies in 2018. And women are extended lower levels of credit than men, which limits the types of businesses they can start. Our financial systems are literally under-investing in women.

4. Conscientious hiring and salary decisions by corporate leaders: We need people in positions of power to actively seek ways to recruit women, include them in their networks, and advocate for them to be promoted into leadership positions. We also need organizations to look deeply into their pay practices to ensure they are not systematically paying women less than their male counterparts.

5. Adjusted school schedules and tax systems to fit modern family life (as opposed to the farm life of the 19th century): Our tax systems and our public school systems were formed at a time when one-earner married households were the norm. Not only have they not kept pace with modern life, but they now serve as significant hurdles to women’s consistent labor force participation. When we start expecting our institutions to change, rather than expecting women to swim against the tide, we’ll start to see real change.

You are a person of great influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. 🙂

I’d love to witness a paradigm shift in the way we value women’s time and the strengths they bring to the marketplace.

Currently, we expect women to give away too much of their time and effort for free or at a discount — both inside and outside the workplace. We also expect women to uphold families, schools, and communities with their unpaid work. As a society we reap the rewards of women’s unpaid efforts as we simultaneously push down the risks to the individual who puts herself in an economically vulnerable position.

Instead of asking women to mold themselves to fit out-dated institutions and norms, we need to demand that institutions and social expectations change to open up more options for women and allow them to realize the full value of their own work .

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

Many years ago I stumbled upon a latin phrase: Astra inclinant, sed non obligant. Translated, this means: The stars incline you, but they do not bind you.

Which is to say, the circumstances of your birth, your upbringing and the choices you’ve made up to this moment — all of those things set you upon a certain path. BUT nothing obligates you to remain on that path — another set of choices can be made, a different path can be pursued if you are bold enough to try and fail and try again.

This is particularly important to me because I was born into a conservative religious community whose message to me from a young age was that my gender was my destiny. While I deeply value the religious community I came from, this small latin phrase allowed me to see myself in terms that extend beyond others’ expectations. In fact, I began to see my own potential as both the greatest gift I have ever been given, as well as my own personal frontier — one that begged to be explored.

That latin phrase spurred me to stay in the workforce after I had my first child, and my second, and my third. It nagged at me until I applied to Oxford. And it encouraged me to take the huge risk of starting a company. Astra Inclinant: Your beginning may be written in the stars. Sed non obligant: ultimately, you are capable of altering the coordinates of your own destiny.

We are very blessed that some of the biggest names in Business, VC funding, Sports, and Entertainment read this column. Is there a person in the world, or in the US whom you would love to have a private breakfast or lunch with, and why? He or she might see this, especially if we tag them. 🙂

Melinda Gates or Michelle Obama — These two women are advocating for the value of the individual in a manner I deeply admire. They see the way that our institutions and societal systems funnel women and other large groups into suboptimal outcomes and they are committed to changing not only individual minds but entire societal systems.

This was really meaningful! Thank you so much for your time.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Lyn Johnson of West Tenth was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“Five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap”, with Gabriela Reynaga of Holistics GRC

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Be patient with new kids on the block. Too often, an initial impression of an employee hinders their success for the duration of their time at that company. Maybe the employee isn’t staying as late as others or takes the full lunch hour while the rest of the office is hustling. It’s important to remember that you don’t know all of the circumstances of your employees. Good managers take the time to figure it out. Maybe then you’ll see that the full lunch hour or after work period was used to care for an aging family member.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing Gabriela Reynaga, CRISC, CISA, GRCP. Gabriela is the founder and CEO of Holistics GRC Consultancy and member of the ISACA Board of Directors. At Holistics GRC, Reynaga offers expertise in governance, risk and compliance by providing audit and consulting services with a holistic approach and carries out risk assessments as well as addressing the convergence of technology and operations processes. Previously, she spent nearly 10 years at Deloitte in a variety of audit and risk services roles and worked as IT audit and governance director at Qualtop, as consultancy partner at Global Practice International (GPI), GRC manager at ISM, and BRS manager Salles, Sainz — Grant Thornton, S.C. Reynaga is a COBIT 5 & COBIT 2019 Accredited Trainer and a public accountant and has been actively involved with ISACA for more than seven years. In addition to her role on the Board, Reynaga is past President of ISACA’s Guadalajara, Mexico chapter and currently a member of the Board of Directors of ISACA and member of the Advisory Board of the Global Forum on Cyber Expertise (The GFCE). Reynaga is an international speaker with ISACA, ASIS, OAS and other organizations, and contributes articles on cybersecurity, IT and corporate governance for various publications.

Thank you so much for joining us Gabriela! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I started professionally as a financial auditor before becoming interested in the connections between information technology and audit. I spent years working for big firms and after much dedication, I felt like it was time to take a chance on a new career path. My career was advancing much slower than I would have liked. I wasn’t reaching the positions that I could have at the pace in which I felt I should have and decided it wasn’t working for me any longer. In some ways, I felt like my career trajectory was hindered because I am a woman. I was told by my supervisor that women want families, not career success. That was the catalyst for my move to the governance compliance industry. I am a strong believer that gender is not a handicap to achieving professional goals, so I told myself I can do it. And I am! I joined ISACA and realized I’m not alone. There is a lot of information out there to support me. Now I have ISACA certifications in CISA and CRISC and became a COBIT 5 & COBIT 2019 accredited trainer. I’m living my dream by owning my own company.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

In 2010, I was working for a firm and came across a job opening for a Director of Consultancy position. I was a manager at the time and was not looking to make a move, but I spoke to my supervisor about what I could do to move into that kind of role in the future. He told me not to worry about it because women get married and have kids and then forget about their professional lives. I was shocked, but I have a strong character and took this as a sign I needed to move up and out. One month later I moved to another firm. This experience is a big reason for my success and why I’m here today.

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

Early on in my career I was on an audit and was following my checklist of questions with a representative from the company very diligently. I was ticking off items on my list and asked a question about whether or not they were applying certain security frameworks. He responded with a framework title, but I was so focused on my checklist, I missed that the framework he cited was for a help desk, not security! Needless to say, my manager was very confused on why I said they were secure. That experience taught me an important lesson: trust but verify.

It is true, women are still outpaced by men in terms of earnings. ISACA recently surveyed its membership about the age and gender perception gap and the results are very interesting.

In my experience, and like that of many of the tech professionals who took the survey, women feel that the lack of female mentorship is a major factor for the gap — 56% of women respondents reported this as the main reason. Regardless of gender, professionals often reach a point in their career where they have questions and need someone to talk to. They feel stuck and don’t know what steps to take to advance their careers. This happened to me, too. I believe it’s always helpful to have someone who looks, acts and thinks like you in a position of mentorship who has successfully navigated through the same challenges. Unfortunately, there’s not enough female mentors in our industry to meet this need, yet.

Secondly, confidence is a major factor causing this gap. The ISACA survey found that 74% of women lack confidence in their ability to negotiate salaries, compared to 64% of men. This is very interesting, because we found that more of those women reported that they successfully negotiated for a salary increase in the last two years than their male colleagues. To this I say, take a chance! Start negotiating. Don’t let uncertainty be a barrier to your own success.

And the third most pressing issue is somewhat centered on my field of work. Men and women are not on the same page and it’s preventing us from closing the gap. Women are twice as likely, compared to their male counterparts, to believe that pay inequity exists between men and women in the IT sector. Men believe women don’t find technology fields appealing, while women overwhelmingly disagree. It’s these misperceptions that are perpetuating the wage disparity. We need to acknowledge these misperceptions and start to address them now.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

I am passionate about this topic. Through ISACA, I’m working to shine a light on why women are underrepresented in tech in an effort to expose the underlying issues and ultimately uncover ways in which we can bridge the gap. On a personal level, I’m sharing my story in the hopes that other women who may be facing similar challenges, feel like they can be successful too. Giving back to people in this way and through mentorship is my personal mission.

Can you recommend five things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

At a broader societal level, we need to take the following actions.

We need to start thinking about hiring talent for their qualifications. They’re there because they think they can do it and their work history shows they can do it. Treat them with the respect that their experiences deserve and ultimately, give equal compensation for equal work.
Be patient with new kids on the block. Too often, an initial impression of an employee hinders their success for the duration of their time at that company. Maybe the employee isn’t staying as late as others or takes the full lunch hour while the rest of the office is hustling. It’s important to remember that you don’t know all of the circumstances of your employees. Good managers take the time to figure it out. Maybe then you’ll see that the full lunch hour or after work period was used to care for an aging family member.
I don’t believe in the saying “fake it until you make it.” I don’t think it’s ethical. My motto is simple: prepare. Studies show that women apply for positions only if they accomplish 100% of the requirements listed in the job description, but men apply even though they don’t fulfill all of the requirements. I think this practice is in bad faith and promotes unequal competition. If you don’t know it, learn it. Don’t say you know how to do it when you don’t. If we can all be honest, then we can begin better addressing the wage disparity.
Be a mentor. We need more female role models in decision making positions, and in the tech industry at large. By sharing your experiences with others, women early on in their careers can learn from them and take better advantage of the opportunities that come their way.
Finally, you’ve done all of the work to find diverse applicants that make your company better, but your strict policies are working against your female employees. Make it easier for women to stay at work by creating policies that allow them to take on the role of mother and career woman. Take the time to understand what challenges women are facing as they work to balance these roles, and together you can brainstorm ways to overcome them. By giving women more flexibility to do their jobs, while maintaining quality performance, we can limit the need for women to put a pause on their careers for motherhood and get more women in top jobs.

I would love to inspire more people to mentor others. If you learn something, I urge you to share it into the world. Giving back to those who have had less opportunity or are new to their respective fields of work is an important way to bring up a more diverse workforce and offer more people greater chances.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote?” Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

My role model is my dad. He raised me, my sister and brother as a single father after my mother passed when I was young. He taught me one of the most important life lessons when I grew up riding horses with him. One time, I was crying because I kept falling off the horse. My dad said to me, “If you don’t want to fall, don’t ride.” He knew the reward for riding the horses was greater than the fear that I’d fall again. That’s how I learned that I need to challenge myself and be willing to take risks to succeed and do the things I want to do in life.

I could have a whole party! If I had to narrow it down, I would share a meal with businessman Warren Buffet, philanthropist and female role model Melinda Gates and philosopher Yuval Noah Hariri, separately of course. It would be hard to have a conversation with all three of them at the same time, so I would start with Yuval and then chat with Melinda and finally end the meal with Warren Buffet.

There are a lot of things that we as a greater society need to discuss in order to optimize the use of technology and not abuse it. I would have that conversation with Yuval. As a result of that conversation, I’m sure I will have a bunch of ideas, so I’ll chat with Melinda about creating a plan. Her influence, interest in supporting minorities and passion for helping others would be invaluable. Then, from both of these conversations, I’d sit down with Warren to talk about putting that plan into action. It would be a long but fruitful meal. ?

Thank you for all of these great insights!

“Five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap”, with Gabriela Reynaga of Holistics GRC was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Impostor Syndrome” With Mike Hondorp of Whalar

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Lean into what makes you uncomfortable. If I hadn’t said yes to meeting up with a colleague after a chance encounter on an elevator, I may not have had the career I’ve had.

As a part of our series about how very accomplished leaders were able to succeed despite experiencing Imposter Syndrome, I had the pleasure of interviewing Mike Hondorp. Mike is Chief Marketing Officer at Whalar, the global creative content and influencer marketing solution. An industry veteran with over 15 years of experience, Mike has managed brand strategy, business development, and marketing for global brands including Instagram, Bonobos, and Ralph Lauren. Prior to joining Whalar, he spent seven years at Facebook, Inc. There, Mike was a key member of the Instagram Brand Development team, which launched Instagram’s business solutions globally. At Instagram, he also led the CPG and retail category product strategy, and provided platform guidance and insights to CPG and retail marketers.

Thank you so much for joining us Mike! Our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your ‘backstory’?

I’ve been in the technology and marketing industry for more than 15 years, and have managed brand strategy, business development, and marketing for global brands including Instagram, Bonobos, and Ralph Lauren, before I joined my current company, Whalar. Before Whalar, I spent seven years at Facebook, where I was a member of the Instagram Brand Development team, which launched Instagram’s business solutions globally.

I grew up in Michigan, and now live in Austin, Texas by way of New York and London. I have always loved storytelling and performing. As a young child, I loved being on stage, presenting, and sharing, and was a singer and actor. I would never have predicted I’d draw on these same skills in my career, but it does seem to make sense in hindsight. The passion was there!

Can you share with us the most interesting story from your career? Can you tell us what lessons or ‘take aways’ you learned from that?

I like to say that my career at Instagram started because I was in the right elevator at the right time. Years ago, I worked at Facebook in London and was just getting ready to move back to the US. While in San Francisco for a conference, I walked into the elevator of the hotel where I was staying and ran into Dan Habashi, who at the time was just putting together a nascent Instagram team. We had known each other from various projects over the years and got along great, so it was a fun surprise to see him there in the elevator. On the way up, he asked how I was doing and what I was doing there, and I told him I was moving back to the US. He immediately said, “You have to apply for this job on my team.” My first reaction was, “there’s a team?” Instagram was still new then, having just been acquired by Facebook. I wasn’t sure what the role even was or what it meant, but as Dan walked out of the elevator on his floor he suggested we grab a drink and talk more. I was exhausted from meetings and my first inclination was to make some excuse so I could just return to my room and catch up on work. But something about this chance encounter pushed me to email him and make a plan, and an hour later we were meeting in the hotel bar to discuss the role and how I could help. I ultimately got the job, after passing muster with a very tenured Facebook legend, Matt Jacobson.

The lesson for me was that great things and great growth can come from taking a chance, pushing outside of your comfort zone and not just doing what you always do. In this instance, it certainly would have been more comfortable for me to say “no” to a meeting that I hadn’t planned on having with an old colleague, simply because I was focused on other things and drained from a busy week. But grabbing that drink opened the door to an incredible next chapter of my career.

What do you think makes your company stand out? Can you share a story?

What I love about Whalar is that we’re all about democratizing creativity. We stand out because we disrupt traditional creative and production models, but even more importantly, we’re empowering more creative voices who haven’t always been a part of the creative conversation, connecting them with brands they love and creating truly smart, beautiful campaigns. Bringing new and different voices into the creative conversations for brands opens up new kinds of thinking and new kinds of outputs, which is really exciting.

One recent campaign I’m really proud of is the award-winning work we did earlier this year to support the United Nations and galvanize global support for UN member nations to address climate change. With Sir David Attenborough as the leading figure, we activated our global creative community to collect social data from around the world. This campaign went on to reach a total of 1.3 billion people worldwide, ensuring the UN’s climate conference COP24 was the top of the global media agenda. The summit ended with global leaders signing up to aims to deliver the Paris agreements goal of limiting global temperature rises to below 2C. It’s so rewarding to work with an organization that is driving change both in our industry and also on global issues that affect us all.

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story?

I’m incredibly grateful to have a strong, core group of former Instagram colleagues that are still friends, mentors and supporters today. In the beginning, there were six of us on the Instagram team who were building and growing something brand-new, and as young people ourselves, we went through this incredible time of learning and growth together. Through those trials, we have an indelible bond, and today we’re “the squad”, and remain close as we’ve each gone on to our next chapters. We are constantly messaging and calling each other as a group for advice, support, celebrations — everything from “how would you present this to a client?” to “hey I’m separating from my partner” — we’re constantly coaching each other personally and professionally.

Ok thank you for all that. Now let’s shift to the main focus of this interview. We would like to explore and flesh out the experience of Impostor Syndrome. How would you define Impostor Syndrome? What do people with Imposter Syndrome feel?

For me, Imposter Syndrome is that feeling of being surrounded by people far more experienced than you, but somehow you have a more senior or at least sought after opinion. You don’t trust that you’re the right person to answer, or even that your opinion should count, because everyone around you is so smart and qualified. For me, it’s that feeling of insecurity and like you don’t belong.

What are the downsides of Impostor Syndrome? How can it limit people?

Imposter Syndrome has many downsides, including crippling anxiety and constant fear of being found out. Feeling this way can mean you focus on the wrong things — for example, pain and fear avoidance instead of creativity and trying new things.

And when you feel insecure, you don’t want to make hard decisions or be unpopular. Unfortunately, a lot of leadership is all about having those hard conversations and sticking to your guns even if it’s not what people want to hear. It’s hard to lead without addressing the affects of Imposter Syndrome, even if you never overcome it entirely.

How can the experience of Impostor Syndrome impact how one treats others?

I think Imposter Syndrome can make you more empathetic. Because you’re so attuned to your own feelings and the work environment around you, you strive even harder to create psychological safety for those around you. For me, I try to lead with vulnerability and transparency, and openly share tough moments so that they’re learning moments not just for me, but for my team.

We would love to hear your story about your experience with Impostor Syndrome. Would you be able to share that with us?

I really started to feel like an imposter as my job grew at Facebook. Facebook was a place for crazy smart, high-achieving, really young people. To go from more traditional corporate jobs to a fast-growing and boundary-breaking tech company turned the traditional corporate hierarchy on its head, and suddenly I wasn’t sure if I could measure up. It was humbling to feel like I wasn’t qualified enough to even be in the room with some of these people.

In my role, I was meeting with the heads of marketing for big, global companies, and even though I had far fewer years of experience than they did, they would listen so attentively to your counsel about Instagram because the platform was so new, and they trusted you to guide them through it. But I didn’t know what I had done to earn that trust, I just felt like I was there.

Did you ever shake the feeling off? If yes, what have you done to mitigate it or eliminate it?

For me, it never goes away, and it never feels like I’m achieving enough. I minimize this by continuing to prove my value and focusing on the work itself. I also try to redefine what a C-level executive does and how they behave, to make it more authentic and approachable than people can sometimes think of senior leadership being. For example, I really like relating to people on a human level — it’s fun to understand what motivates people, what their home life is like, what music they’re into, and just be fun and silly sometimes. That’s how we build connections with each other.

In your opinion, what are 5 steps that someone who is experiencing Impostor Syndrome can take to move forward despite feeling like an “Impostor”? Please share a story or an example for each.

Know your material/subject, and over-prepare. For example, last month we launched our 2020 influencer marketing trends report with a big event for clients in New York, which I hosted. I had been living in the research for three months, so I was also confident that I knew my stuff. The event was a huge success.
Lean into what makes you uncomfortable. If I hadn’t said yes to meeting up with a colleague after a chance encounter on an elevator, I may not have had the career I’ve had.
Be vulnerable and transparent. It builds trust immediately and builds psychological safety. For example, I was speaking at a conference last year and mistakenly misgendered a creator I featured in a presentation to hundreds. I was mortified, and while I apologized profusely, I felt terrible for my error and any discomfort it caused them. Rather than ignore it or try to forget it, after the event I shared what had happened with my team, so that it was a learning moment not just for me, but for all of us.
Understand that you’ll never truly get over it, and that’s OK. It’s part of who you are. I think about my Imposter Syndrome constantly, but I also know I can’t let it hold me back.
Try channeling the anxiety for good — put it to use in your own way and let it motivate you. For me, I use these feelings to both fuel my ambition for great work that makes a difference, as well as remind me that everyone needs to feel comfortable to do their best work.

You are a person of great influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the greatest amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. 🙂

For me, two of my biggest concerns are the climate crisis and ensuring equal human rights on a local level. Every human is worthy of respect, safety, and equity. These are quite personal to me; I live in a state where it’s legal to fire employees because of their sexuality, so I strive to support human rights and equality every day.

We are blessed that some very prominent leaders read this column. Is there a person in the world, or in the US, with whom you would love to have a private breakfast or lunch, and why? He or she might just see this, especially if we tag them 🙂

There are so many! Whitney Houston — I love her talent, one of her songs was my husband’s and my first dance at our wedding. Michelle Obama — a human rights campaigner, she is inspiring and real. I relate to her transparency and vulnerability, and that she owns who she is.

How can our readers follow you on social media?

Instagram @hondorp

Thank you for all of these great insights!

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Impostor Syndrome” With Mike Hondorp of Whalar was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Tracey Smith of Numerical Insights

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

The overall wage gap of a company or population does not take into account whether men and women are in similar job roles. Only in similar job roles goes comparing salaries make sense since each job role can have a very different market value. Do we expect a brain surgeon to be paid the same as an hourly fast food worker? Of course not. It makes no sense to compare salaries of everyone together. To measure equity, we need to conduct an apples-to-apples comparison within specific job roles. Only then, can you measure fairness across gender.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing Tracey Smith. Tracey Smith is regarded as a thought leader and strategic adviser in the field of analytics. She has over 25 years of experience applying mathematics, statistics and data analysis to business problems. Tracey is the President of Numerical Insights LLC, a boutique analytics company serving large and medium-sized companies. She holds degrees in Applied Mathematics, Mechanical Engineering and Business from well-recognized universities in Canada and the U.S. Her career spans the areas of mechanical engineering, supply chain and human resources. Tracey has been recognized as one of the “Top 50 Global Influencers in HR Analytics” and one of the “Top 15 HR Analytics Experts to Follow.” She is also CPSM certified through the Institute for Supply Management. Tracey is the author of several books and hundreds of articles published in industry magazines and online web sites.

Thank you so much for joining us Tracey! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

My career began in engineering 25 years ago. My job role was to use data analysis to predict the performance of automotive components. Throughout the years, I expanded the areas where I applied data analysis to business situations which led me into the areas of supply chain inventory analysis and human resources analytics. It was in the area of human resources that I began to extensively study gender-related data inside global companies. At the same time, I began to read scientific gender studies that had been conducted over the past few decades.

First, it is important to understand the wage gap measurement because it has been incorrectly interpreted as a measure of equality. It does not measure fairness or equity and the creators of this measurement admit his… but you have to go three levels deep on their web site to find this admission.

Inside any company or a population of people, the wage gap is the difference between the median salary of men and the median salary for women. The median is nothing more than the middle salary value if you were to list everyone’s salary from lowest to highest. The value that lands in the middle of this list is the median. This is what is done to determine the median value for male and female salaries. The wage gap is the difference between these two values.

The overall wage gap of a company or population does not take into account whether men and women are in similar job roles. Only in similar job roles goes comparing salaries make sense since each job role can have a very different market value. Do we expect a brain surgeon to be paid the same as an hourly fast food worker? Of course not. It makes no sense to compare salaries of everyone together. To measure equity, we need to conduct an apples-to-apples comparison within specific job roles. Only then, can you measure fairness across gender.

For example, a highly technical job commands a higher salary on the market. Non-technical jobs tend to have a lower salary value in the job market. Unless an equal number of men and women choose these technical professions, and we know this is not the case from examining graduating university classes, there will automatically be a gender gap in technical and scientific companies merely as a result of the choices men and women made regarding their university area of focus. I underline choices to emphasize that it is what men and women choose to do that impacts the gender gap measurement. It isn’t something that companies did. The choices impacting the gender gap happen long before anyone enters the corporate world. Blaming companies for the gender gap is incorrect.

That said, there are a few things companies can to do encourage the choices that men and women make in the work world. I have analyzed human resources data for several global companies to measure the fairness of hiring and promotions across gender. I have never seen a bias against women in the hiring or promotions process. For example, if 50 men and 50 women choose to apply for a management position, we expect that roughly 50% of promotions would go to men and 50% of promotions would go to women. In all of the data I’ve analyzed, this is exactly the case.

What I have seen in corporate data though, is that as women approach the management levels, they are less likely to apply for an internal promotion into management. We do not see 50 men and 50 women applying for the management position I mentioned above. We likely see 30 women and 50 men apply.

The reasons for this are several. Most people assume that entering the management level requires longer work hours and greater amounts of travel. For women with young children, they may choose to delay entering the management levels to keep their time free for family commitments. Additionally, studies have shown that the wording used in job descriptions can impact the proportion of men and women that choose to apply. If the wording uses more aggressive terms like “go-getter,” it can yield more male applicants. If the job description uses less aggressive words and is described as collaborative, it can yield an increased number of female applicants. Based on gender studies, large companies are now adjusting the wording in their job descriptions and explicitly stating when a job role will have minimal travel associated with it.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

My work is about educating people on how to accurately measure fairness for men and women. I take company data and use statistically analysis to analyze the fairness of hiring and promotions. I also use data to provide insight into whether a company is seeing a reduced number of female applicants for internal promotions and providing suggesting on how that can be improved.

My role outside of corporations is to educate the general population on how badly misrepresented the gender gap measurement is. Women do not “make 80 cents for every dollar a man makes.” Women have predominantly chosen professions that command a lower salary on the job market. To alter the gender gap value, more women need to choose a career path that has a higher market value such as those in the areas of engineering, science, technology and math (STEM). These choices are made when women are very young and this is why we have seen a large number of events, conducted by educational institutions in partnership with corporations, to introduce girls as young as the age of 8 to technology.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

Understand why the gender wage gap measurement isn’t a measure of gender equity.
Encourage women to apply for management roles.
Introduce your daughters to technology.
Ensure young girls participate in activities that boost their confidence.
Educate young people, regardless of gender, on how career choices impact their future financial success.

This was really meaningful! Thank you so much for your time.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Tracey Smith of Numerical Insights was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Imposter Syndrome” With Author Mike Kitko

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Dive deep inside of yourself and see what’s in there. The chaos that I experienced was a direct result of living a life driven by what was going on in my outside world. I lived an unconscious life based on what I could see, hear, taste, and touch. I spent time trying to avoid the most valuable sense — feeling.

As a part of our series about how very accomplished leaders were able to succeed despite experiencing Imposter Syndrome, I had the pleasure of interviewing Mike Kitko. Mike Kitko is an executive coach and speaker. In October he published his first book, “The Imposter In Charge,” about his rise and fall in his life and career from the imposter syndrome. He found external success in the world through powerful titles, incomes, and material possessions, and ultimately fell into depression, alcoholism, and the near collapse of his family before he began a journey of internal happiness. Mike now coaches executive leaders to feel as powerful on the inside as they appear to those they lead.

Thank you so much for joining us! Our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your ‘backstory’?

During my childhood, my time in the Marine Corps, and in my rise and fall in corporate America, I never felt adequate. I always exceeded expectations and found success, but I never felt good enough. I lived a life of inadequacy and insecurity, just waiting for it all to fall apart — and eventually, it did. I lost my career and almost lost my life and family. After losing my second executive position in 20 months, I figured out that I had nothing figured out, and I began a journey of self-discovery and self-mastery.

I rebuilt my belief system, health, relationship with myself, relationship with my family, and decided to never do anything I dislike ever again. The only thing I’ve ever enjoyed in leadership roles was growing high-performing people and high-performing teams. Now I get to do that full-time, and I find adequacy and security inside of myself — not in my titles, income, or possessions.

Can you share with us the most interesting story from your career? Can you tell us what lessons or ‘take aways’ you learned from that?

I was the Plant Manager of an operating plant in Portland, Oregon, for Stanley Black & Decker. I took over an underperforming plant and built a team capable of outperforming just about every other facility and team in the business. We executed an amazing turnaround, and our financial and operational performance was best-in-class. I would put that team up against any other team on the planet.

Once my team and plant were in place and performing, I felt useless. My inadequacy and insecurity kicked in and I felt like it was just a matter of time before I was pulled into a conference room and fired for being excess baggage, because my team did all the work. I just hired, trained, and led them. I didn’t value myself or my talents, so it felt like I was unnecessary and a burden to the business. I started looking for another job so I could leave before I was fired. I was looking to escape because I wasn’t self-aware enough to know that I was talented and a valuable resource in the corporation.

I did escape and my family began fracturing from years of personal and relational neglect. We relocated to Missouri for a corporate move, and I was fired twice over the next few years. You never outrun the imposter syndrome until you look inside to find what’s real, uncovering stories that had been made up and healing them as you go.

What do you think makes your company stand out? Can you share a story?

I bring the intensity and courage of my Marine Corps training, my business acumen from years in corporate leadership positions, and new life skills and awareness to leaders and teams. I often find myself coaching the leaders on how to create a sound, strategic objective aligned with their talents and visions, hold them accountable for their physical, mental, and emotional health, and help them connect more deeply with their spouses in the same session. My coaching business is not just about excelling as a leader but empowering the leader within each individual to ensure that we can create a life well lived.

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story?

Definitely my wife, Angie. I spent years thinking that as the alpha male in the house that I was the courage, strength, and power in our family. Not true. I am powerful in my words, actions, and in the fire and wisdom I bring to the boardroom and my coaching, but I am not all of that at home. My wife has battled and overcome an abusive childhood, rape, neglect, addiction, and the lack of leadership in her youth. She left home at 13 and was legally emancipated at 15.

Angie and I spent years battling inside of an abusive relationship because I was a 50’s-style husband with strong egoic role identity and gender posturing. Angie has taken leadership over our family and demonstrated that she is the leader of the family, and she is the fuel for my passion and success.

Without recognizing that she is my power, courage, and strength, I definitely wouldn’t have built a coaching business as quickly as I have.

Ok thank you for all that. Now let’s shift to the main focus of this interview. We would like to explore and flesh out the experience of Imposter Syndrome. How would you define Imposter Syndrome? What do people with Imposter Syndrome feel?

My experience with the imposter syndrome is absolute self-rejection. When I was in deep in the chaos of the imposter syndrome, I felt like I held no value or worth in the world, and that I was just disposable. I was handed accolade after accolade, and reward after reward throughout my entire life — starting from 4 years old on. I felt none of it. I just felt like I was always in the right place at the right time, they were recognizing me out of pity and sympathy, or that I just had an unfair advantage. No matter how hard I worked or how much I knew or performed or achieved, I always felt on the cusp of complete and absolute failure.

My life was exhausting because I felt like everyone was valuable except for me. Looking back at it, it seems impossible, but I felt I was just taking up space and had nothing to offer anyone. I was just a nuisance.

I spent my entire life trying to not be found out. I hid who I was, my fears, and my weaknesses. I played roles and pretended that I had it all figured out. I shape-shifted to be who I thought I needed to be in order to be accepted and valued. I wore masks, and I eventually came close to sticking a gun in my mouth. At that point I knew I was missing something.

What are the downsides of Imposter Syndrome? How can it limit people?

People with the imposter syndrome feel they can’t be themselves and succeed. They don’t feel good enough. One of the pieces of advice we’re taught — “fake it until you make it” — is the imposter syndrome spoken out loud. The expression says human beings need to be perfect and have it all figured out all the time. Imposters become paralyzed if someone finds out they are not perfect or there’s something they don’t know or have.

I remember sitting in conference rooms making almost $200,000 per year hoping to not be exposed as a fraud. Being exposed meant not knowing the answer to a question. It’s like we need to be all things all the time to be relevant. Of course, that’s impossible, so we spend all of our time hiding in the shadows, and, in my case, people kept promoting me and praising me. It was complete chaos.

The imposter syndrome simply takes away your ability to feel like you matter, and that you can just show up as yourself, as you are in that moment. You need to be something you’re not to be valuable.

How can the experience of Imposter Syndrome impact how one treats others?

I was abusive at home. I intimidated my teams. My intensity, tone, and aggressive nature increased to protect myself when someone challenged me. It was all self-protection, because I was afraid that I’d be found out to be imperfect or a fraud. I hurt people and pushed people away to maintain the false façade. I lied to those who mattered to me because I felt that the truth made me less than I already felt, and I already felt disposable.

Different people react in different ways. More introverted people might react by remaining more quiet. I have a current client who goes into a shell even more when his inadequacy is triggered. I would become more outspoken and aggressive to try to prove myself or to try to regain control. You focus on deflecting attention away from what you don’t know or the parts of yourself that feel broken and incomplete.

We would love to hear your story about your experience with Imposter Syndrome. Would you be able to share that with us?

In my book “The Imposter In Charge,” I shared a story from my childhood. I went to a baseball tryout when I was very young. I remember riding home in the car with my dad feeling like I absolutely tanked. I felt like I’d be lucky to get picked at all.

When I received the call I was the first overall pick in the draft. Not only had I not tanked, but I had excelled.

This type of performance, self-assessment, and results showed up over and over in my life, and it was so confusing. I just always compared what I didn’t do well to what others did well. I compared my weaknesses to their strengths, and I overlooked their weaknesses. I couldn’t see their imperfections, but mine were my entire focus.

Did you ever shake the feeling off? If yes, what have you done to mitigate it or eliminate it?

I did shake it off, after I lost my career and income, came close to taking my own life, and came close to losing my family. I had to do a complete reset. My physical, mental, and emotional states were all in complete chaos. I had neglected my own needs for decades. I began a massive search for a new perspective because I knew there were some disconnects in how I processed life.

My childhood was traumatic with abandonment, neglect, and molestation, so I dove into those headfirst and began to recognize why I felt disposable. My beliefs began to shift to healthier ones as I found out deeper and healthier truths about spirituality and being human. I set out to heal every disconnected aspect of my life and being, and I found that the journey never ends. Inadequacy and insecurity still surface, but I have a better understanding of how to relate and manage them instead of trying to hide them away. I have learned to love and appreciate exactly who I am, and that fuels a desire and willingness to continue to grow and evolve. This self-love and self-appreciation has created a deeper sense of love and appreciation for everyone in my life.

In your opinion, what are 5 steps that someone who is experiencing Imposter Syndrome can take to move forward despite feeling like an “Imposter”? Please share a story or an example for each.

Dive deep inside of yourself and see what’s in there.

The chaos that I experienced was a direct result of living a life driven by what was going on in my outside world. I lived an unconscious life based on what I could see, hear, taste, and touch. I spent time trying to avoid the most valuable sense — feeling. I tried to avoid physical, mental, and emotional pain in my life, and this caused even more fear, alcoholism, abuse, neglect, self-rejection, and crushing pain. When you finally realize all of the pain and suffering that is present inside, you can finally begin to heal the painful traumas showing up in your daily life.

We live in a culture that values sedation, avoidance, and escape from our internal suffering. Facing the suffering and pain inside of you will help you resolve it, and you’ll no longer fear having those conditions triggered. What you feel heals. I ran from my pain for so long that it shaped my world. You can reshape your world at any time by facing your internal torment.

The first time I dove into my emotional scars and wounds, and faced my childhood abuse, I cried like a baby. I kept feeling the pain of my abuse and cried for so long I became numb. This emotional work released and healed so much pain that I actually felt lighter. This was the first time, and I’ve done similar work daily from that day forward.

We all have pain and suffering trapped inside. Facing it helps you find the freedom your mind has convinced you that you can find in sedation, avoidance, and escape. You’ve got to feel it to heal it.

2. Fully embrace yourself.

You are perfectly imperfect, just like the rest of us. You are not broken — you have just convinced yourself that you are. We all have trauma, pain, and suffering inside. We have all made missteps and mistakes, and we all have done and experienced things that create guilt and shame inside of us. You’re just like the rest of us, so why not embrace and accept yourself? No one is making you hold yourself in the captivity of your past, and you can give yourself permission to release yourself at any time. If there’s anyone who uses your past against you, or uses guilt and shame as a weapon, eliminate them from your life. You deserve better. Guilt and shame are the weapons of the weak.

You have the same material composition as any other human being. There’s nothing that separates you from everyone else except for your relationship with yourself. Please understand that you’re perfectly imperfect — just like everyone else.

I have a client, and we’ll call him Ken. Ken is a high-powered C-suite executive who is highly talented. He had a checkered past and did some things when he was 13 that do not make him proud. This past experience involved manipulating and influencing someone to do something they didn’t want to do, for his benefit. Ken convinced them against their will. He never told anyone before he told me. When he revealed some of the things he had done, tears and shame showed up everywhere. I allowed him to vent, because he had been holding these in for too long.

When he reached a critical point and collected himself, I asked him what he learned from his shameful experience. He said that he has not repeated the behavior since and makes sure he avoids any circumstances that could put him back into a similar situation. He said he wanted to help people, not manipulate them. I helped him understand that his childhood experience, which created guilt and shame for a long time, created a heart of gold. Because he recognized who he didn’t want to be, he chose to be better the rest of his life.

At that point, Ken decided to embrace himself and his past, and his guilt and shame were released that day. You were born perfectly imperfect, and there’s not one single person on this planet of 7.7 billion who hasn’t made a mistake. Forgive yourself. Embrace yourself. Accept yourself fully and watch your entire life begin to feel more free and peaceful. Rejecting yourself hasn’t created peace, has it?

3. Fully embrace others.

When you finally forgive yourself for missteps and mistakes, and when you fully accept yourself, you begin to do the same for others. When you finally stop holding yourself captive, or cease holding yourself accountable for perfection, you begin to release others from those same expectations. Not one person is perfect, but yet we hold others accountable for perfection, too.

One great acronym that changed my life is L.O.V.E. — letting others voluntarily evolve. When we allow others to be perfectly imperfect just like us, we begin to embrace, love, and appreciate who they are instead of our own image of who they should be.

I was driving on the highway one day when I was nearly cut off by a person who didn’t bother looking before changing lanes. I honked my horn, I got super angry, and sped up to let them know that I wasn’t pleased. They sped away because they knew what they had done. I slowed down and cooled off.

A few miles down the road, I was still thinking about the audacity of the person almost hitting me. I put my right blinker on to change lanes to exit the highway and began to change lanes. I heard a loud car horn from the right lane, and I realized that I didn’t look around fully before I started my lane change.

That day I realized that the only time we can judge someone or reject someone’s actions, behaviors, or choices is when we are perfect. Until then, we can only L.O.V.E. them.

4. Decide what you want to be in your life and be it.

If you feel like an imposter, then it’s because you are not fully aligned with your natural gifts and talents. You are putting yourself in a place where you feel you need to be. You have rejected the notion that you get to do what you enjoy in order to preserve your lifestyle or achieve your desires. If you don’t wake up excited to embrace the day, where you will go, what you will do, or who you work with, realize that you’re missing out on the best part of life — living a life designed by you, for you.

I saw a speaker one time talk about how when he was chasing money, he would do anything his clients asked him to do. When he realized that he didn’t have money and he was miserable, he decided to stop doing things that didn’t excite him. He decided there was only one business problem that he would solve, and he tripled his prices. Since he was excited about that thing, he became excited about showing up for his clients, and because he loved doing that thing, the product he created was top quality. His customers began to refer others to him, and his business skyrocketed. He raised prices to slow demand.

In this life, you get to decide what you want to be, and you get to be it. To feel unaligned in your work and life brings suffering and pain to your daily activities. This gives the imposter syndrome free reign to kick in. Rejecting yourself is a key catalyst — and symptom — of the imposter syndrome.

You’ll never feel like a fraud if you are honest with yourself, honest with others, and just show up and do what you love.

5. Surround yourself with those who support your vision for your life.

Not everyone will cheerlead you on to success. Not everyone wants you to live the life of your dreams. Sometimes these people could be family or friends who are also settling for less than they desire. It’s critical to only surround yourself with cheerleaders and supporters instead of people who pull you down.

When my life collapsed, I joined a local mastermind. In that mastermind, I was the only one who was in transition, and there were a few successful millionaire entrepreneurs. I watched how they carried themselves, and it was different from unsuccessful people. They used different words and language, held different beliefs about money, and saw life and business much differently than anyone I had ever been around.

I listened and learned, and naturally my beliefs and approach to life began to shift. I heard how they saw the world, and that opened me up to new possibilities and opportunities. Where I had experienced lack, they saw opportunities. Where I saw roadblocks, they saw challenges and growth.

I’ve been in that mastermind for over 3 years, and my life has changed as result. That group of people changed the way that I perceive everything. I now coach one of those successful millionaires’ businesses. I also help him with life challenges. Things have shifted radically.

Who you invite into your life matters. If they are not for you, they are passively (or actively) working against you. If you surround yourself with unsuccessful people, it’s just a matter of time before you become unsuccessful. Surround yourself with those you wish to emulate, and it’s just a matter of time before you are just like them.

I would move humanity to realize that they never need to be or appear to be someone they’re not. I would inspire them to see that when they are not excited about life, it’s because they are living life on someone else’s terms, or they’re living someone else’s vision or dream. I find that so many people are living a life they hate to appease someone they love, or they are doing things that do not inspire them for the sake of outcomes that will not create the happiness they expect.

I would move people everywhere to realize that when you finally decide to show up as yourself, for yourself, and in a state of stewardship for society, you feel a sense of purpose, significance, and value that is unimaginable outside of that unique, authentic alignment.

When we all just show up as ourselves, for ourselves, there’ll be nothing left to hide, and we all can start living soul-out, and stop chasing the illusion of happiness that’s infiltrated our inauthentic society.

Bill Gates. I would love to sit down and learn from the guy who never shied away from who he is, fully embraced his strengths, weaknesses, and desires, created a huge vision, worked tirelessly to materialize that vision, and now continues to be himself while he solves the deeply embedded problems in the world. Bill Gates is the epitome of genius, authenticity, power, and love all wrapped up in an amazing human being.

How can our readers follow you on social media?

You can connect with my website at www.mikekitko.com, my LinkedIn profile at https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikekitko/, my Facebook business page at https://www.facebook.com/mikekitkocoaching/, and my Instagram page at https://www.instagram.com/mike_kitko/.

This was very inspiring. Thank you so much for joining us!

Thanks for the opportunity! Live powerfully, inside and out!

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Imposter Syndrome” With Author Mike Kitko was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Impostor Syndrome” With Ricky Joshi of The…

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Impostor Syndrome” With Ricky Joshi of The Saatva Company

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Believe in your talents. Always look at your talent as the base rather than focusing on the task. If you know you can achieve something because of past experiences, then keep that at the forefront of your mind.

As a part of our series about how very accomplished leaders were able to succeed despite experiencing Imposter Syndrome, I had the pleasure of interviewing Ricky Joshi. Ricky Joshi is the co-founder and CEO of The Saatva Company. The Saatva Company sells luxury, affordable, and organic mattresses online, made with sustainable materials in the USA.

Thank you so much for joining us Ricky! Our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your ‘backstory’?

I, along with my business partner Rod Rudzin, created Saatva when we saw a need for a more eco-friendly and sustainable mattress in the luxury bedding space. My background wasn’t in bedding and lifestyle, though. I started in the agency world, but I saw a lot of potential in lifestyle as it merged a lot of my interests.

Can you share with us the most interesting story from your career? Can you tell us what lessons or ‘take aways’ you learned from that?

As with any company, when you start out, you can feel like a little bit of an imposter in a new space. This was true for myself and colleagues because our backgrounds were in business. Though we were interested in lifestyle, we still had a lot to learn. We had several meetings and lots of back and forth where we just tried to nail down what our vision and mission statement should be. My biggest takeaway from those meetings is to always rely on your team. Business is not a solitary avenue; you will always need good people around you who can bring new ideas.

What do you think makes your company stand out? Can you share a story?

Our company stands out because of our extremely competitive pricing. We are the highest rated and best priced luxury mattress online. We truly believe that sustainability doesn’t mean you should sacrifice quality or pay an astronomical amount.

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story?

I’m grateful to Ron for his vision and his tenacity. Especially in the early days, I felt like there were many times I hit a wall and couldn’t pass through it. Ron is an idea guy — he’s great at thinking outside the box and I’m really grateful to be working on this venture together.

I would define imposter syndrome as feeling like you don’t belong in a place where you’ve earned recognition. We don’t feel imposter syndrome about things we aren’t good at, but for some reason, we feel it strongly about things we’ve strived towards. People with imposter syndrome feel dejected, as if they do not deserve an award or promotion or praise for an accomplishment.

What are the downsides of Impostor Syndrome? How can it limit people?

The biggest downside is a lack of morale and motivation. If someone does not feel like they deserve something, they will act as if they don’t, and this is a huge disservice to talented workers who are making significant strides in their career. It limits the mind, and because of that, a person’s productivity and determination at work can suffer.

How can the experience of Impostor Syndrome impact how one treats others?

If you don’t have faith in your abilities or you continue to see yourself as lesser than in the spaces you occupy, then it will be hard for you to feel like the people in your workplace are your equals. As it affects your self-esteem, it will affect your work output and work relationships.

We would love to hear your story about your experience with Impostor Syndrome. Would you be able to share that with us?

Absolutely! Like I mentioned before, coming from the agency world meant I was well-versed in business. My interest in lifestyle was strong, but as I worked on the business model, attended events, and met other professionals, there were definitely times where I felt like I did not know what I was doing. While I knew intrinsically that I was competent, I found difficulty in navigating this new space with my new company. That’s what’s so tricky about imposter syndrome: you know you’re good, but it doesn’t always show.

Did you ever shake the feeling off? If yes, what have you done to mitigate it or eliminate it?

Yes, through consistency, I was able to work my way out of it. Every time I accomplished something, I would remind myself that it was because of my talents and perseverance, and that I deserved to be there.

In your opinion, what are 5 steps that someone who is experiencing Impostor Syndrome can take to move forward despite feeling like an “Impostor”? Please share a story or an example for each.

Believe in your talents. Always look at your talent as the base rather than focusing on the task. If you know you can achieve something because of past experiences, then keep that at the forefront of your mind.
Ask for help. I was fortunate enough to have Ron through this journey, but friends and colleagues are a great support system when you need a reminder.
Start small. If something seems too daunting, make sure that you scale back and start with something small and manageable. Once you conquer that, it’ll be easier for you to conquer future, larger tasks.
Visualize your success. Keep your eye on the prize and look forward to what you want to achieve rather than playing into your doubts.
Prepare for disappointment. This is key. It does not mean anticipate failure; it means come up with a plan in case of failure. How will you move forward after the fact? Putting these in place early can help you navigate tricky personal feelings.

I’d love to see less plastic in packaging when it comes to bedding.

How can our readers follow you on social media?

You can follow us at @SaatvaMattress on Twitter for updates.

This was very inspiring. Thank you so much for joining us!

“How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Impostor Syndrome” With Ricky Joshi of The… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Megan McCann, CEO of McCann Partners

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Recommend women for internal career opportunities — Studies show that women are less likely to apply for a position if they don’t feel like they qualify or haven’t completed all the requirements. Internal business leaders need to keep this in mind and remember to recommend qualified women when positions open. It’s a win-win approach, as the company gets to keep valuable internal talent with less time needed to recruit and/or onboard, and women get a better shot at competing for leadership roles.

I had the pleasure of interviewing Megan McCann. Megan is an established IT recruitment and technology services leader known for building and leading highly successful IT services firms, and for the work she does to advance diversity and cultivate talent across the technology industry. Megan is the CEO of leading IT recruitment firm McCann Partners, which she founded in 2011. Megan and her team continue to expand their reach and influence, working with a growing portfolio of diverse and innovative organizations — from Chicago-based startups to companies with a global footprint. Prior to McCann Partners, Megan co-founded and helped build Geneva Technical Services (GTS), and was a strategic force in growing SelecTech — both premier IT recruitment firms. Megan’s impact on the tech community far exceeds her day-to-day work as CEO of her own firm. Passionate about attracting, retaining, and advancing women in technology, Megan is a proud co-founder of ARA, a national organization that seeks to promote women in technology and leadership through mentorship, networking, and open discussion. She is also a founding partner of the Chicago Executive Women’s Networking Group, and was recently recognized as a 2018 Enterprising Woman of the Year, a Midwest Women in Tech Awards finalist, and an Illinois Technology Association CityLIGHTS award finalist.

Thank you so much for joining us Megan! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

Prior to starting my own business, McCann Partners, I co-founded and helped build Geneva Technical Services (GTS), and was a strategic force in growing SelecTech — both premier IT recruitment firms. I was also the Director of International Recruitment and Assistant Dean of Admission at Wittenberg University, my alma mater.

The catalyst for founding McCann Partners was a desire to open doors for others. That continues to be the company’s guiding principle and daily inspiration. I like to come back to the idea that If I am opening doors for others to opportunity, challenge, innovation, creativity, and success, I am doing something important. The IT recruitment market is a crowded space, but my firm prides itself on being different. With a focus on creating meaningful connections and mindful solutions, we don’t just place talent. We take a deep interest in what matters most to the people and businesses we work with to help them grow and prosper.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

About 18 months ago, I decided to do something I had never truly done before. Turn off my phone, go completely off the grid (yes, from email, social media — everything!) and take a journey of self-exploration and reflection. I headed halfway around the globe to Bali, Indonesia, for a retreat that level-set my professional and personal sides in the most profound way possible. As an entrepreneur, it can be difficult for me to unplug. I have always been fearful about how my time away will impact both my team and the business. This fear led me to put myself on the back burner. After two weeks away and a lot of (a lot!) of time spent meditating, I learned that the magic of putting yourself first is remarkable. It reminded me that to create meaningful change and impact, no matter what your profession or avocation, you have to put yourself first. The shift has not been easy for me: it takes commitment and consistency. The experience inspired and enlightened me, and is certainly one of the most interesting journeys I’ve taken in my career.

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

This falls more on the “interesting” side of the spectrum, but about five years after I started my own company, I almost made the mistake of letting fear decide my future. McCann Partners experienced a perfect storm where everything that could go wrong, did. I felt paralyzed watching all the great work my team had helped me achieve go down the drain. I couldn’t see the positives, and it felt as if I was looking for a way out. I almost walked away.

Spoiler alert: I didn’t quit. But I almost did. Reflecting, one of the most profound lessons I learned from this near mistake is that the temptation to quit will be greatest just before you are about to succeed. Because I finally was able to look myself in the mirror and face the fear, I’ve bounced back. I wish I could say I did it all with grace and strength, but it was a messy process. To this day, I keep this experience top of mind, and it even inspired me to create a list of mantras I keep near to help quell the fear when it starts to ebb.

The gender pay gap is a complicated issue, and varies greatly depending on race, socioeconomic status, and location.

Of the many factors contributing to the pay gap, here are three of them:

Occupational segregation — Male-dominated industries tend to have higher wages than industries and occupations made up mostly of female workers.
Bias against working mothers — Without flexible options to have time to care for family and pursue professional goals, women, more often than men, tend to choose to work part-time after having children. This often affects a woman’s long-term ability to earn as much as men.
Direct pay discrimination — Simply put, statistics show that when men and women interview for the same job and have the same experience, men are offered more. According to AAUW research, in a comparison of occupations with at least 50,000 men and 50,000 women in 2017, 107 out of 114 had statistically significant gaps in pay that favored men; six occupations had no significant gap; and just one had a gap favoring women.

Regardless of the facts that frame the conversation, we all need be transparent about the wage gap and take action. That means women and their male allies coming together and shining a light on the issue, especially at the leadership level. For example, when hiring, companies should be mindful of the discrepancies in compensation at their organization, and fix accordingly.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

As the owner of my own IT recruitment firm, McCann Partners, I’m in a unique position to observe the impact of the gender wage gap on the women we recruit each and every day. I see first-hand how they earn less than men in virtually every category, with minorities at the greatest disadvantage. I also see how moving up the corporate ladder can make the disparity even greater. As part of my work, I help women confront these realities and provide them with strategies for mitigating the effects. In addition, I spend a lot of time coaching women — industry peers, colleagues, mentees, and more — to do their research. There are a variety of tools available to ensure they’re equipped with facts (vs. fiction) that empower their personal advocacy. With my client partners, I often frankly discuss the cost of hiring — and retention — and the importance of not only pay equity in that conversation, but building programs to support women in the workforce as they advance.

I’m also actively involved with addressing the gender wage gap as co-founder of ARA (Attract, Retain, and Advance women in tech), a national organization that has reached more than 6,000 people in seven cities across the country. Finally, I’m an ongoing mentor in the Chicago Innovation Women’s Mentoring Co-Op.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

Here are five things I’ve identified for closing the gender wage gap:

Eliminate base pay discrepancies — Simply put, offer the same salaries for base pay regardless of gender. That’s it. It seems obvious, but we’re not doing this enough as business leaders. Level out the playing field right from the get-go. Transparency within an organization is key here, and leadership needs to play an active role in educating their teams and hiring managers on pay equity.
Teach women negotiating tactics — I strongly believe we can do more for young women, especially those just starting out their careers, when it comes to negotiating tactics. I can’t tell you how many stories I’ve heard from women that have never countered a salary offer, whether as part of a raise or as part of an initial job offer. If negotiating isn’t learned at an early stage, then women are already playing catch up right out of the gate! This is something we can begin to introduce earlier to give women and girls to educate them about the issue and how to take matters into their own hands. In the past few years, the Girl Scouts have added badges for STEM activities like coding and space science. I’d love to see one on salary negotiation!
Provide them with mentors (both female and male) — This is one I’m especially passionate about as a co-founder of ARA (Attract, Retain, and Advance women in tech) and as an ongoing mentor in the Chicago Innovation Women’s Mentoring Co-Op. Mentorship. It is more important now than ever for men and women to come together to forge valuable relationships that are essential to career growth. A mentor provides insight into the complicated nature of corporate structures and relationships because they’ve “been there.” This type of input is invaluable, regardless of gender, and this transfer of knowledge is key to closing the wage gap. As a mentor, I am passionate about opening doors, creating connections, and empowering future generations. I also aspire to be an advocate and role model so my niece, goddaughter, mentees, peers, and colleagues, can stand tall and achieve in ways we’ve never seen before. I like to think of it as being a daring tribe together — forging stronger ties to help advance other women and impact future generations.
Recommend women for internal career opportunities — Studies show that women are less likely to apply for a position if they don’t feel like they qualify or haven’t completed all the requirements. Internal business leaders need to keep this in mind and remember to recommend qualified women when positions open. It’s a win-win approach, as the company gets to keep valuable internal talent with less time needed to recruit and/or onboard, and women get a better shot at competing for leadership roles. I’ve recently wrote about a successful diversity and inclusion program that Groupon recently created called GREAT (Groupon’s Resource for Emerging and Aspiring Talent). It provides resources and opportunities to the company’s high performing, under-represented employees. By helping develop women, and other under-represented groups, into future internal leaders they’re creating change within their own ranks.
Provide flexible work arrangements — Flexible work, such as telecommuting or shifting work hours, means that women with caregiving responsibilities can hold jobs in higher-paying industries and companies. It makes it more realistic for talented women who have children or are caring for a relative to find meaningful work in a job that otherwise wouldn’t be a fit for them. Even if a company doesn’t offer a formal flexible work policy, I often encourage women to speak up and ask about options. Some departments and/or managers may be able to make flexible arrangements for their teams, and it’s the start of a compelling (and very timely) conversation. In the end, it may be something that ends up changing throughout the organization.

If I could inspire a movement, it would be one of equality for women and girls in our society, not only in the United States, but around the globe. It spans politics, sports, the workplace, family life, and so much more. And, while wage equity is vitally important, it is one piece of the puzzle. For generations, women have pushed boundaries and created change. Are we done? Not even close, especially when it comes to women in lesser developed nations. To be at the forefront of a movement for true equality for women worldwide would be an accomplishment for the ages. Even if my voice and actions don’t result in monumental change on that level, I am hopeful that stepping up in the ways that I do and working to make a difference will help create more cracks in the ever-present glass ceiling.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

“If you don’t ask, you won’t give someone the opportunity to say yes.” This is one of the mantras I developed for myself after almost letting my fear get the best of me early on after starting my own business. Whether it’s reaching out to a prospect, asking an industry colleague to speak at an event or negotiating a contract, this is one of my cornerstones. It is an especially helpful outlook if you’re asking for a raise or negotiating a job offer, and this attitude is helpful in battling imposter syndrome. Don’t hold back in asking the question even if you feel like you don’t belong, shouldn’t ask or should remain quiet. As I tell my mentees, and myself, the worst you’ll get is a no, and you’ll have the clarity that you spoke up for what you deserved.

Because it takes more than one person to make sustainable change, I’d like to propose another scenario: a dinner party for MANY. I would invite those who have come before from who I can (and have) learned and those of the future, like my niece, nephew, and godchildren who will be tasked with carrying this mission forward.

If I had to limit it to one individual, I’d invite Melinda Gates. Not only is her recent announcement to commit $10 billion over the next 10 years to expand women’s power beyond impressive, but the way she consistently uses her voice to advocate for women across the globe is incredibly inspiring.

Thank you for all of these great insights!

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with Megan McCann, CEO of McCann Partners was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

Michael O’Brien of Peloton Executive Coaching: “How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing

Michael O’Brien of Peloton Executive Coaching: “How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing Impostor Syndrome”

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Accomplishments List — Develop a list of life and career accomplishments and mantras that will help you counter-balance your self-narrative when it gets negative or anxious. You can develop your list in private and then ask others what strengths they see in you.

I had the pleasure of interviewing Michael O’Brien. Michael is the Chief Shift Officer at Peloton Executive Coaching. He elevates successful corporate leaders by preventing bad moments from turning into bad days, as he illustrates in his current book, My Last Bad Day Shift. His award-winning, best-selling memoir Shift: Creating Better Tomorrows chronicles his Last Bad Day and near-death cycling accident recovery journey. He has shared his inspirational story and leadership expertise on the TEDx stage and with multiple Fortune 500 companies, Entrepreneur, Fast Company, ABC, Real Simple, and Authority Magazine.

Thank you so much for joining us Michael! Our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your ‘backstory’?

Thanks for having me. I’ll start with the promise I made when they put me on the medivac. I made the commitment that if I lived, then I would stop chasing happiness. I made that promise on July 11, 2001, after being hit head-on by a speeding SUV during a bike training ride. I consider it My Last Bad Day. Over time it has become one of my best because it has helped me shift my perspective on almost every aspect of my life and reach the executive suite on my terms.

During my recovery, I knew that I would eventually help others write a different life and career scripts so they can achieve more happiness and success. I see my work today as one of the reasons I survived my Last Bad Day.

Can you share with us the most interesting story from your career? Can you tell us what lessons or ‘take aways’ you learned from that?

When I was a few years into my sales career, I lost my position in a company-wide downsizing. It was my first experience with job loss and I started to become angry and worried about my future.

A few months later, something interesting happened. The recruiting firm that they provided called with a new “ground-floor” opportunity that was too good to pass up. That company became my home for eighteen years, but, most importantly, I gained the type of experience my clients need today. It helped me see that often things happen for a reason or when one door closes; another opens. Now I look back at my downsizing with gratitude because it was a gift that led to many wonderful career experiences.

What do you think makes your company stand out? Can you share a story?

It comes down to the results that my clients achieve. Over 87% have gone on to positions with more influence or compensation after they discovered how to lead differently. But the most meaningful results are when my clients tell me that their husband or wife now sees that they are happier, which makes a significant difference at home. They become better partners and parents and become wealthier, starting from the inside-out.

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story?

When I was in the ICU from my Last Bad Day accident, I told my wife to find David. I shared that “he will show us the way.” When I moved from the ICU and my wife asked me about David, I was surprised because I never talked about work at home. She had no idea who he was until I said something in the ICU.

David was the first executive coach in my life. My team hired him about six months before my accident, and he was starting to help me discover different leadership approaches. When my wife shared that I referenced him, I knew it was a sign that I would follow in his footsteps and he’s been a mentor to me ever since.

Thank you for all that. Now let’s shift to the main focus of this interview. We would like to explore and flesh out the experience of Impostor Syndrome. How would you define Impostor Syndrome? What do people with Imposter Syndrome feel?

Impostor Syndrome has impacted seventy percent of the US population and involves feeling like a fake or fraud because you don’t feel like you have the proper skills, training, or experience. What’s interesting about imposter experience is that feelings of loneliness, worry, and anxiety often occur after an accomplishment because you begin to believe that your success isn’t warranted, and others will see it as well.

What are the downsides of Impostor Syndrome? How can it limit people?

The challenges with impostor syndrome are significant because when present, your feelings can restrict you from moving forward with confidence and lose confidence in your ability to perform.

How can the experience of Impostor Syndrome impact how one treats others?

Having dealt with Imposter Syndrome, I can attest that when it’s present, it impacts our relationships. It’s common for us to feel alone, cynical or skeptical. As a result, it’s harder to partner with colleagues and trust and productivity starts to wane.

We would love to hear your story about your experience with Impostor Syndrome. Would you be able to share that with us?

My first experience with imposter syndrome came after I was promoted to National Sales Director. I started to believe that the only reason I got the job was that I was the only candidate willing to move to New Jersey. I also thought I had to lead like all the National Sales Directors in my industry, but that wasn’t my style. As a result, I lost my identity for a few months. It was an extremely stressful period and I wondered if I was the right person for the job. These feelings stayed with me until I shifted my thinking and regained my confidence.

Did you ever shake the feeling off? If yes, what have you done to mitigate it or eliminate it?

Yes, I was able to shake off my imposter syndrome by shifting the conversation I was having with myself by developing an accomplishments list and a few mantras that helped me see why I was promotion. I also started looking for small wins, which I knew would lead to bigger ones down the road, which they did.

In your opinion, what are five steps that someone who is experiencing Impostor Syndrome can take to move forward despite feeling like an “Impostor”? Please share a story or an example for each.

Here’s what I do when I feel like an imposter and recommend to my clients today:

1: Breathe — When imposter syndrome is present, it’s common for your head to be spinning and be filled with emotion. It makes it hard to know what to do next. Focusing on your breath slows you down, shifts your perspective, and sparks a healthier self-narrative.

2: Accomplishments List — Develop a list of life and career accomplishments and mantras that will help you counter-balance your self-narrative when it gets negative or anxious. You can develop your list in private and then ask others what strengths they see in you.

3: Develop Your Network — Since life and career are not solo projects, it’s essential to have a strong network. They can help you see attributes you might not realize — especially when can’t.

4: Small Wins — Look for small victories to gain the type of momentum that will lead to big wins down the road and reframe your situation.

5: Gratitude — Develop a gratitude practice to help you see what’s working in your life. You can even be grateful for your moments of self-doubt or feeling like a fraud because they are a natural part of being alive and an opportunity to show yourself and the world that you are gritty.

My recovery from my near-death cycling accident has been a miracle. I now believe that one of the reasons I lived is to help over 1,000,000 people have their Last Bad Day and live life and build their career with awareness, purpose, gratitude, and community. I know my Last Bad Day can help others live their best days.

There are so many I wish I could name. If I could only choose one, it would be Sir Richard Branson because he has written his script, achieved great success, rebounded from setbacks, and seems to be wealthy from the inside-out.

How can our readers follow you on social media?

Yes, they can follow me on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram.

Thank you for all of these great insights!

Michael O’Brien of Peloton Executive Coaching: “How I Was Able To Thrive Despite First Experiencing was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with John Schwarz CEO of Visier

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

Organizations need to take both a macro and micro look at their pay practices to understand if they are fairly compensating their employees. If there is a clear difference in scale or compa ratios, then it is clear there is a bias.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing John Schwarz. John is the Founder and CEO of Visier Inc., a cloud-based analytics platform that helps professionals ask the right questions, see important truths about their business, and plan a better future. Prior to founding Visier, John led Business Objects from 2005 to 2010, where he doubled the size and profitability of the company and guided it through seven strategic acquisitions, including its sale to SAP in 2008. John then joined the SAP Executive Board and oversaw the successful integration and expansion of SAP’s Business Intelligence unit. John was also President and Chief Operating Officer of Symantec during the period of its biggest expansion from 2001 to 2005. He began his career in technology at IBM, where he spent 25 years contributing to its evolution from a hardware company to a software-and-services led business. A respected industry expert, John has been covered in publications such as the New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Entrepreneur, Fast Company, TechCrunch, and VentureBeat. John is a Director on the Boards of Synopsys, Teradata and Chairman of the Board of Avast, as well as a former board member of SuccessFactors and Verity, and a member of the Dalhousie University Advisory Board.

Thank you so much for joining us John! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I was a brand new immigrant to Canada from central Europe when I started my college education. In my old country, as far as I knew, computers were secret machines only used by the police to keep tabs on citizens. When I started college in Canada, I had to use computers to do analysis on data in my chemistry class. The idea that I could program a machine and give it some data to return an answer to a question was so exciting that I switched majors and joined the first graduating class of computer science at my college. The rest, as they say, is history. Today, my firm is developing analytics to keep tabs on employees — but to help them to be successful, not to punish them for having inconvenient relationships.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

My first developer role was managing a payroll system in an insurance company that employed people in 54 different countries. They paid them from a central payroll system operated at the HQ. My job was ensuring that all the taxation changes passed in 54 countries were implemented on time so we could cut accurate checks. The challenge was that most of the countries pass laws effective on January 1 of the new year. Guess where I spent my time from Thanksgiving to New Years? Sleeping under my desk and just going home to shower and get clean clothes.

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

My most interesting mistake was made mid-career. I was running one of the most successful development sites in my company, with a really significant mission. I was about 2 years into this role, things were going really well and I was having a great time. Then the company changed CEOs, and I was asked to move roles (and re-locate) to become his technology advisor. This was a staff role, with no operational content. Just be an advisor to the CEO. I turned it down. In retrospect, this was the dumbest decision of my career. The new CEO was very successful, and all the people on his staff went on to great achievements in the business. I made up for it later in my career, but never stopped wondering what might have been had I made the change. I have never passed up an opportunity since.

The conversation about the wage gap is usually limited to the direct numbers comparison, and while that is an easy way of showcasing the disparity, it doesn’t paint a broad enough picture to truly understand what’s happening.

What we have discovered is that the wage gap starts to form at around the age of 32, which coincidentally is the average age at which women start to have children. The gap grows from there until about the age of 45, and then it narrows a bit because women tend to have a better performance rating at mid-career than men, but women never catch up completely. The early thirties are also the age at which people reach their first supervisory position. Women are under-represented as supervisors, and supervisory positions carry a much higher pay than individual contributors, ergo women end up with lower average compensation than their male colleagues in the same age cohort.

One of the driving factors that can be attributed to the wage gap is the penalty of motherhood. By that I mean, in families who chose to have children, it’s much more likely that the woman of the household will take maternity leave than the man. While this seems innocent enough, what can happen is women who do take maternity leave may be perceived as prioritizing their family over their career, even unconsciously. This leads to fewer opportunities when they return to work, not to mention that the time taken off puts them behind their (male) colleagues who decided to stay. Even if the environment in the organization eliminates the perception bias, the simple fact that the woman is absent from the job for a year or more means that she will get her promotion later than the male colleagues, and the wage gap starts to build.

There is also the problem of relationship building. A male dominated work environment has built certain structures to allow for networking, relationship building and general social gathering. We’re seeing that these particular types of social structures, like after work drinks, sports-related outings, networking events, etc don’t necessarily help women in the workforce, especially those with families who are unable to attend events during after work hours. There is of course more nuance to this problem, but it’s something that hasn’t been given much thought of until lately.

Finally, there needs to be more emphasis on learning and development opportunities for women, including mentorship. A shortage of female leadership naturally means fewer natural opportunities for women to seek out successful role models and mentors. It has long been demonstrated that a successful female role model has a dramatic knock on positive drag -along effect on other women in the organization.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

We specialize in people analytics and workforce data. That means we take the raw data, that every company has on their employees, and help provide meaningful insights into their people. By having these insights at their fingertips, organizations are able to clearly see aspects like their gender diversity (overall and in departmental levels), hiring practices, potential bias, gaps in learning and development and employee relationships. We also deliver benchmarks for comparisons relative to the 7 million employees in our database.

We provide the tools and the best practices for organizations to be able to make the necessary changes, but it’s up to the companies to utilize the insights to the best advantage. Our customers generally produce 2 times the ROIC of the average in their industry.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

It will take a combination of societal changes and individual business changes in order for this to work:

1) Examine pay practices at every level to ensure fairness across employee segments.

Organizations need to take both a macro and micro look at their pay practices to understand if they are fairly compensating their employees. If there is a clear difference in scale or compa ratios, then it is clear there is a bias.

2) Examine the distribution of gender across all levels and functions of the organization. Look for outlier departments and assess the reasons why they are different. Look for bias in promotions to management.

3) Measure and monitor efforts for a more inclusive and diverse workforce. Look for outliers and examine the reasons for the different outcomes. Ensure that there is gender balance in the leadership of the organization at all levels. In California, there is a quota on women in the boardroom. Why not in other, far less responsible positions?

4) Stop penalizing women for maternity leave. Offer women who commit to return to their job positions from maternity leave in a reasonable timeframe the same promotion opportunity as their colleagues who hadn’t taken a leave. Count the maternity leave as time in the job. Offer a subsidy for daycare.

5) Ensure that women in your organization have access to female mentors even if you have to import them from the outside.

I believe that the most serious problem created by technology is that people who work in lagging industries are being left behind. They are left without hope. The consequences are awful — populist governments, opioid addiction, mass shootings, xenophobia and racism. If I could do just one thing, it would be to give these people new hope — a hope in finding a meaningful role, a living wage for the family, a future that is promising. I believe this could be achieved by a massive investment in industries that will replace carbon-based energy and transportation, and by a significant investment in the retraining of people whose jobs are at risk of being obsolete. We will have to do this anyway — if we don’t fix global warming, we will pay for relocating cities to higher ground, defending our borders from masses of displaced migrants and our homes from angry unemployed people.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

“Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results is the definition of madness.” Albert Einstein. In tech, core innovation happens every three to five years. Companies begin to stagnate as a result of the ‘innovator’s dilemma’. In essence, companies that have a business with a critical mass have a problem re-inventing themselves because the re-invention usually cannibalizes the current business. I used to think this only applies to very large businesses. Not true — every business that has reached a critical mass is subject to this challenge. The relentless pace of innovation will undermine every economic endeavor. Those that want to keep doing the same thing over again do so at their peril. In fact, the pace of innovation is accelerating.

I think a meeting with Dr. Yuval Harari would be incredibly insightful. I’ve enjoyed reading his work and commentary on how we as a species have evolved, and where we could be heading in the future. As a person who has some influence on the future of work and the impact of AI, I would like to learn where to draw the line.

This was really meaningful! Thank you so much for your time.

“5 Things We Need To Do To Close The Gender Wage Gap”, with John Schwarz CEO of Visier was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.

“Five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap”, with Jessica Wooke of RobustWealth

An Interview With Candice Georgiadis

More conversations need to take place at the executive level. Organizations need to look at their entire ecosystems to inspect where change needs to take place to ensure there are adequate measures, policies and cultures to foster equality. Everything from recruiting to retirement services needs to be inspected.

As part of my series about “the five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap” I had the pleasure of interviewing Jessica Wooke, Chief Experience Officer at RobustWealth. RobustWealth is an innovative fintech company and B2B digital wealth management platform headquartered in Lambertville, NJ. As Chief Experience Officer, Jess leads the strategic direction of all RobustWealth platform experiences. Jess has a diverse technical and customer-centric background. She previously spent four years at Comcast, most recently as part of the engineering team that launched the Xfinity Mobile product. She has gone against the grain and has been very successful in two male-dominated fields (tech and finance). As such, she is passionate about mentoring younger generations of women in fintech.

Thank you so much for joining us Jessica! Can you tell us the “backstory” that brought you to this career path?

I grew up with two hardworking parents; my dad was a plumber and my mom a chemist, turned entrepreneur. Mom built and ran a successful retail business for over 30 years, and I grew up working alongside her. I think it’s safe to say I got my hardworking attitude, business acumen and technical/mechanical abilities from my parents!

In thinking through potential career paths, I wanted something that was fun, engaging, challenging and creative. I thought a career involving computers and creating software fit that bill, so I studied Computer Science, Information Systems and Technology, and Business at Drexel University. I graduated with a Bachelor’s degree in Management Information Systems and a minor in IT. Thankfully, my desire to be in the IT industry has proved to be a good path for me thus far! Through Drexel’s Co-Op program, I was introduced to the world of Network Infrastructure Engineering and loved how my career began after those opportunities. It was a heavily male-dominated field, and I learned a lot about engineering, teamwork, leadership and even myself. I stumbled and fell and learned a lot through it all.

Finding my way into the still heavily male-dominated software development field as a technical program lead and scrum master was another entirely different joy. Though by this time, I saw that as an opportunity to challenge the status quo and push ahead with my voice, experience and perspective. I’d say those days of my career were a success and helped me to step into more coaching, leadership and team-building opportunities. The last five years have really been an interesting and rewarding stretch. I’ve overseen dozens of product launches by my various teams and met with customers to listen to their feedback and pain points. This present state of listening, learning and creating has been one of my favorite stops along the way.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began this career?

Early on in my career after taking on new responsibilities, a colleague approached me to share his congratulations. He made a comment that he hoped I would be properly paid now with these added responsibilities. I think he had the best intentions to call out the gap between my compensation and that of my peers, and it was clear he felt the discrepancy was unjust. This for me, however, was a shock. I didn’t know what to do with this information or how to react. It wasn’t something that was discussed openly or debated like it is today; there was no spotlight to shine on issues like this or space to discuss these experiences. This realization has certainly shaped me and how I approach things since, however.

Can you share a story about the funniest or most interesting mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

I’m not sure if this qualifies as a mistake exactly, but I find it funny now and it certainly was a great lesson in the long run. I recall when I was interviewing for a role, a colleague from a previous job volunteered to help the hiring manager screen me. He was asking some pretty strange questions. I knew he was aware of my skills and background and that I knew all the answers to his very basic questions. As it turned out, he was intentionally trying to drop some subtle hints about the role and its associated challenges, and I completely missed the message. Needless to say, I nailed the interview and got the job, only to find that it was nothing like what I expected or desired (duh!).

It sounds cliché but I endeavored to make the best of the situation, learned a lot about a new platform and added many great friends and connections to my personal network. At a much later happy hour reunion, I had a good laugh with my colleague when he finally spilled the beans about the interview hints he had been trying to drop for me! The even bigger lesson I learned is hints don’t always work. If you want to convey a message, just get straight to the point.

It is still shocking to see the data around the wage gap. I think there are quite a few factors driving it. I by no means have all the answers here, but I’ll speak from my own experience and perception.

I think for some women who have been in the workforce for a significant stretch already, there’s a challenge to overcome their fears and tune out the critic in their head to seize the opportunity and discuss these gaps. I felt this firsthand when I was entering the workforce. When confronted with the wage gap between myself and peers, I had no idea what to do. I was like a deer in headlights. I was not equipped mentally to march myself into my boss’ office or into HR to have a discussion. Worse, my inner voice would tell me to stop “whining,” and my irrational fears about being retaliated against would stop me from moving forward. So, I convinced myself I had to work my way up like everyone else. Looking back though, and knowing what I know now, not everyone else did earn their place, at least not in that regard. I thought that the rules of working hard, delivering quality results and demonstrating value were the only factors driving pay. I was so naive. Now I try to educate myself continually about these things and coach younger people, regardless of gender, about these issues.
Working to find a clear path to action is another obstacle in our way. It’s one thing to talk about the issues, yet another thing entirely to continue to push the boulder up the hill and down the other side. Some organizations are nimbler and more adaptable while others are large and have decades of policies in place, thereby seemingly presenting more barriers to change. It’s sometimes hard to find the right champions for change, and it can be harder yet to find people with authority to make changes. Getting people past their current mindset and finding those with an authoritative voice to help within those organizations is a path forward to making the gap nonexistent.
Collecting the data, studying the current landscape and communicating to the masses is a challenge. Enabling and creating a safe space for frank and open conversations about the issues is important as well. It’s sometimes difficult for people to feel safe having the conversation. I know I didn’t feel safe talking about my first experience with the gender wage gap until nearly a decade later. It’s the responsibility of my generation and those before me to pave the way and make the future better. We should do all we can to educate and mentor younger generations.

Can you share with our readers what your work is doing to help close the gender wage gap?

Discussing the importance and value of women in finance and tech, as well as mentoring younger generations of men and women entering the workforce is how I help push for change. I think it’s helpful for people in my position to have an open dialogue. I recently joined the Ellevate Network, a global network for professional women dedicated to helping each other succeed. I look forward to connecting with other changemakers and discussing topics like this in safe, encouraging environments.

At RobustWealth, we also make a conscious effort shine the spotlight on the women in our firm whenever we can. One third of our executive team is women. While we know there is room for growth here, we believe that this is a great starting point and a step in the right direction.

We also look to Principal Financial Group, our parent company, for advice on how to make RobustWealth a great place for women to work. Over the years, Principal has been recognized by Forbes as one of the best places for women to work.

Can you recommend 5 things that need to be done on a broader societal level to close the gender wage gap. Please share a story or example for each.

More conversations need to take place at the executive level. Organizations need to look at their entire ecosystems to inspect where change needs to take place to ensure there are adequate measures, policies and cultures to foster equality. Everything from recruiting to retirement services needs to be inspected.
For recruiters and HR, I would recommend reviewing the language used in job postings and being open to different approaches to recruiting. Just because the hiring process worked in the past, doesn’t mean it’s going to be right for the future. I have had tremendous success recruiting and helping my network through recommendations and referrals, which is sometimes a departure from traditional job postings. I recommend that leaders talk with their partners in HR and start the conversation on different methods for recruiting. I’ve found that overly long and drawn out job postings don’t always do the best job of attracting the top potential talent. Looking specifically at the younger generations entering the workforce, there is more interest in what the culture of the company is like and what a typical day would entail. Those should be highlights of the job postings if that is the targeted demographic for the position. Companies should better highlight all the extra perks and benefits they offer, in addition to a few brief bullets about the job responsibilities.
Lean on agile principles, inspect and adapt existing benefits. There are great advancements being made in fintech today — why not use more of this amazing technology to better your employees’ retirement savings outlook? I love when a company uses their own technology to benefit their employees. For example, some fintech firms offer free financial planning for their employees. That’s a fantastic benefit, in addition to company matching 401(k) plans. This would help reduce the barrier for women who traditionally aren’t taking an active role in planning their financial well-being. According to a recent study from UBS Global Wealth Management, 58 percent of women leave financial choices up to their male partners.
It’s amazing how big the gap is between men and women when looking at their retirement savings and other investments. Why make the retirement investment solutions that a company offers its employees a one-size-fits-all matching contribution? Companies should adjust the contributions or employer match to better serve the diversity of employee needs. What if we had a fintech firm offer more innovative investment products and a better factors-based asset allocation alongside this? Women and men approach investing differently, and the technology used to setup and manage their portfolios should take that into account. Leveraging risk-based behavior plus factor-based technology to select the right assets for a person is an advantage that everyone should be able to leverage.
I have had great experiences attending coaching classes, seminars and training events geared toward women. I think more women should be offered access to these events and receive company sponsorship to attend a female-focused event at least once a year. It’s an investment in the employee’s growth with the opportunity to practice presentation, negotiation and coaching skills. This experience would benefit organizations in the long run, so it’s a win-win investment.

I would love to see more visibility for the stories about those organizations or even departments within companies that have been successful in closing the wage gap and making strides for more women in middle and upper management levels.

Organizations should support and sponsor their employees to join coaching groups or mentorships outside of their present roles. There’s so much potential to gain perspective, knowledge and understanding if you step out of your comfort zone and organizational silos.

I’m also a supporter of employees doing a skill/role rotation and being able to “intern” with a different team or organization for 6–12 months. Especially where women in technology is concerned, this provides opportunity for more women to learn about and experience different roles and career paths firsthand. As a visual and hands-on learner, I had the privilege of participating in a Co-Op through Drexel University, and that was the closest thing to a job rotation that I had ever done at that point. It opened my mind to consider the possibility of pursuing new roles and jobs that I previously didn’t think I would like or be good at.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

“Be yourself. An original is always better than a copy.” This was a quote I followed very fondly in my youth and still to this day. I find when I’m true to myself, when there’s congruence in my actions and my core values/beliefs, I’m at my best. It’s also important that I stay my most authentic self now that I’m a mom, so that my children learn this very important life lesson.

I really admire the work that Sallie Krawcheck does as CEO and Co-Founder of Ellevest. She’s knowledgeable and is a force for good when it comes to financial education for women, creating inclusive environments and standing up against things that don’t serve us or our business ecosystems any longer.

Thank you for all of these great insights!

“Five things we need to do to close the gender wage gap”, with Jessica Wooke of RobustWealth was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.